Not the score and not the price - diamonds

So a lot of people who have far more experience than I do are saying that it isn’t the score nor the price. There are great wines out there that don’t score we’ll not cost a fortune.

Post your diamonds in the rough. Wines that score 86 or lower and cost less than $18. I am sure this is super subjective but I want to see these gems.

I’ll post the first one. My girlfriend tells me that her go to bottle on an average night is Estancia pinot noir. I can’t say I was overly thrilled by it. Drinkable? Sure. A gem, hardly. But…

Post those gems for me please.

Why worry about the score? - just ask for gems $18 and below.

Cameron Dundee Hills Chard
Pepin Loire muscadet
Selbach Oster riesling
There was some special on Arcadian 2007 Sleepy Hollow pinot for $25 - forget the store

2010 Olivier Leflaive Setiles
2010 Produttori Langhe Nebbiolo

Both in the $18-15 range and probably 88-89 points. I bought 1-2 cases of each this year. Grest drinking and great for cooking also.

With the case discount La Clarine Farms Sumu Kaw Syrah is awfully close to $18/btl, and it kills!

Are these the kinds of wines i will find ar grocery stores, sams clubs, costco, etc? I kind of feel like that easy get to place would be a requirement as well.

And we arent looking for the daily drinkers, we want the jewels. A wine you can pick up that has a low score and costs little but you wouldnt be ashamed to share it with friends or family who also know something about wine. Not experts but enjoy a glass.

Why would you want a wine with a low score? Whose score?

Are these the kinds of wines i will find ar grocery stores, sams clubs, costco, etc?

Different requirement. If the wine is at grocery stores in the midwest, it’s not likely to be one of the wines mentioned. The wines that are going to appear in those kinds of stores are going to have to be made in large volume and they’ll have to be pretty standardized. That pretty much precludes them from being “diamonds”, although they can certainly be OK to drink. They’ll be more like glass crystal.

Estancia for example, is owned by Constellation Brands, which I believe is the biggest wine and spirits company in the world. They also own things like Ravenswood, Toasted Head, Mt. Veeder, Clos du Bois, Wild Horse, Simi, Blackstone, and they recently acquired Robert Mondavi. That’s in rough order of what I’d drink - you may feel otherwise. They also own Corona and a number of beers and vodkas and spirits. Chains like dealing with them because they can get everything they need from one source and have only one delivery and one bill. Take a look at your local grocery store and I’ll bet you see all of those brands.

Gallo owns even more. Barefoot Cellars, for example, is everywhere. From Argentina they own Don Miguel Gascon and Alamos, from Australia Clarendon Hills, from Spain Las Rocas and Martĩn Cõdax, and from the US, too many to list but they include Rancho Zabaco, Dancing Bull, MacMurray Ranch, William Hill and Apothic, which seems to be the current fave in some quarters.

Doesn’t mean all of those wines are no good. I would drink those if someone poured them and I even have some Clarendon Hills.

There are a handful of companies that own enough brands to supply all the grocery stores and other big chains and that’s what they do. For my money, the one that’s consistently the best is Chateau St Michelle, which, in addition to their Washington wines, also owns Conn Creek, Stag’s Leap and Villa Mt. Eden in CA. So if you’re talking about grocery store wines that people would drink, that would be my nomination.

And again, the scores are irrelevant. Las Rocas used to get 91 points when Eric Solomon owned it. Now that Gallo owns it, I don’t know, but they’re likely to be more consistent in quality. I had a bottle the other day, just to try it since I’d not had it in a while. Pretty good for the price IMO. A little short, but for like $10, nothing to complain about.

I think the 2010 Albert Bichot - Bourgogne is a very serviceable Pinot Noir, and it should run you about $10 - $15. You shouldn’t be able to find drinkable Pinot Noir at such a low price point, but this wine makes it possible. I have no idea how many points this received from the critics, but I would expect it to score quite low. Even I score it out to only about 82 or 83, but it’s a simple, pleasant little wine and it works well with food, and it just fits the bill for a mindless sipper.

Any vintage of the Yves Cuilleron - Vin de Pays Syrah is an excellent wine, and should be less than $20. In fact, I’m drinking some right now, and it cost me $18. I have no idea how many points this wine has garnered from the critics, or even if it has been reviewed at all; I would expect it to score somewhat highly — no reason to ignore it, though!

Meo Camuzet Bourgogne Rouge

Great advice from GregT. My own feeling is that you need to lose the focus on scores. They are not an attribute of the wine, they are some other person’s opinion. When you are asking for hidden gems, you just want to know why someone likes the wine. The style of the wine is of far more importance than some score.

Joe, what kind of wine do you (and your gf) like?

white / red?
nuanced / big?
young / aged?
any particular varieties that thrill you or disappoint you?

If we know what you are looking for, we can maybe steer you to an inexpensive treasure more easily. By the way, these are the sorts of questions that a good wine merchant will ask before advising on wines. If they simply say, “this got 95 in WS” then they aren’t taking their job seriously, or think you are a lemming.

Masseria Li Veli Salice Salentino Passamante is one of the best reds I have enjoyed under $20. It is available at our high-end supermarket here. Look for a prominent “Li Veli” on the label.

Ok.
Red not white
Big for me
I have drunk three turleys zinfandels. A 2010 rattlesnake which was great, a 2010 old vine which was too too young so i went for a 2002 dragon which for me seemed past its time.

I really like the zins.

I also like malbecs and so far the best was a $20 achaval ferrer i had a milbrandt from oregon too at a restaurant but cant find at binnys yet.


I like a big high alcohol wine. Lots of fruit. Best cab so far was the 2007 caymus and im looking for similar ones to that. Was told a few names and bought a 2006 vinyard 29 cru which was ok but no caymus. Actually the second day the cru was better.

I have drunk a few pinot noirs. The best was probably either the drouhin or the gevry chambertin but there was a real difference in these so i am still experimenting.

Cotes du Rhone and Beaujoloais are rich with gems for under $18. Here are a few. Without looking up the scores, I suspect these are over 86 points.

2010 Grand Veneur Champauvins Cotes du Rhone
2010 Chave Mon Coeur CdR
2010 Piaugier La Grange CdR
2010 Dom de la Solitude CdR

None of these will blow you away but they are all solid and enjoyable daily drinkers.

I’ll add 2010 Domaine Charvin Côtes du Rhône (Le Poutet)

Say no more. Parker IS your man…honestly. The most recent issue has his list of “Some Exceptional Values”, at $25 and under.

RT

Don’t tell me THAT!

If you like big, high alcohol wines, you might want to experiment with Zinfandel, which on the whole tends to be a lot cheaper than Cabs.

These are NOT the places to be finding really well valued wines. You can get the big brands for cheap at places like Costco, but the selection is extremely lacking, as it is anywhere else like the businesses you’ve mentioned. Even if you have to travel a bit, it would be so much better to go to a good wine shop and stock up periodically.

I also really like this wine, and around here, it’s about $13. I think southern Italy in general is a great place to find value.

Also, for what you like, Spain should be perfect. Check out Borsao Tres Picos. It’s under $18 and I think you’ll love it. It should be pretty widely available.