I’m building a house, which will include a roughly 1200 bottle cellar. I’m going with WCI winemaker series racks (already on site, but not installed).
When I was working on the layout, I never considered small bottles, like 375mm ports and desert wines. So, I didn’t plan for any half/split dedicated racking. I do have a couple diamond bins, and 8 case/rectangular bins.
Does anyone make adapters that can sit crossways across the bottle opening to let small bottles rest on?
What do people with wood racking do with 375 mm bottles, if you didn’t buy any racking purpose built for the small bottles?
It seems like it would be easy enough to use some wood or wire to run between the wood the larger bottles rest on, and create a hammock of sorts for the smaller bottles to rest on.
I’ve been a big wine fan for a long time, but since I’ve been limited to a couple fridges up this point, I mostly have focused on drink now wines, and only have a handful 80 bottles or so, of wines with a long drinking window or that need another 5-10 years to drink.
I’ve lurked on this forum for a while, just never created an account until now.
I bought 2 columns designed specifically for 375s. But based on my experience, I wouldnt dedicate a lot of space for 375s since they’ll usually sit comfortably in normal sized racks. In fact, most of my 375s don’t even fit in my 375 racks.
I know this is off topic on the thread I just created, but I didn’t want to create another new thread as a new member.
Is Cellar Tracker (what I’ve been using for my wine coolers) and eSommelier the only real options for inventory management? I am not finding much info on eSommelier. It appears to be a slick system, but I don’t know if their wine DB (including drinking windows) is on par with cellar tracker.
There are other options out there, including good old spreadsheets or even a *cellar book. I hear that MyWines might be coming out before the next millennium (in-joke).
For me it’s the size of the (user input) database that makes CT the winner. It makes adding new bottles very easy, and the owner Eric LeVine has in the past offered to assist people uploading a large inventory. You could PM him if it feels daunting, but TBH it’s not difficult to upload them. There is also barcoding option if you want to be really slick about the process.
The drinking windows should be treated with caution. Like other crowd-sourced data, it may not reflect what your own preferences are. For me they are generally too short/early, and it’s very rare I find myself entering my own drinking dates earlier than the average. I do recommend adding your own dates.
regards
Ian
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My sister discovered one of these when renovating her house (which used to be a hunting lodge). What was drunk was of interest, but by far the most striking observation, was how they’d easily get through a bottle a head in wine, but also with at least half a bottle a head in gin!!!
I’m approaching 5000 posts and I still do not have a good solution to the 375 issue in my cellar. I lost a 375 of Yquem about a month ago when it slid out of a rectangular bin, so don’t do that.
As to cellar management software, I use Cellartracker, I have used it for almost 10 years, and I think it is GREAT. Yesterday, I had to manually enter a new wine that was not already in their dataset for the first time in years. It was a mag of crappy Argentinian Malbec that someone gave me as a gift. I probably should have just made stew and not bothered.
I’m familiar with CT and have been using it (have run 400+ wines through it over the years) for five or more years. What I haven’t done, because I was only dealing with 2 or 3 wine coolers, is mess with labels and such.
Now that I have the rack space (actually, looking back at my final design it will be closer to 1400 capacity), my collection is about to grow rapidly. So, I was just wondering if I should continue with CT, or consider springing for eSommelier. Obviously, I could use the $4k to buy 6-12 cases of wine for the cellar.
Don’t waste your money. Several people with much larger collections use CT. I’d actually be genuinely curious to hear a single argument as to why anyone should spring $4k on eSom when, as you mentioned, you could buy some mighty nice bottles of wine with $4k.
Regarding the 375 issue, how many 375’s do you really plan on having? I have about 1,000 bottles, and I don’t think I have 20 375’s. YMMV, but it seems to me that most collectors don’t have many 375’s, so you may be better off storing the majority in 750ml racks (most will fit), a diamond bin, or just a 375ml OWC.
I would guess 50-100 tops. Mostly looking at getting some 375 vintage ports. I’m about to buy a dozen or so 2011 ports, and possibly some '03 as well. Then, I would expect to add a dozen or so vintage ports every few years (depending on how they are released). I like the idea of buying the halfs of port, since it will often just be my wife and I drinking them.
I guess I’ll see if they fit in the individual storage, if not, can use wooden cases.
Billy
There isn’t a need to create labels, but it’s worth considering what approach you’ll take with inventory (i.e. keeping on top of it). There are many techniques e.g.
Use CTs barcoding to swipe every bottle in and out
Print your inventory and scribble arrivals and departures on it until ready to type the updates in
Use a tablet to update in-situ for all arrivals & departures
Write new locations on invoices / receipts for new wine & write Tasting notes on every wine drunk to remind of the need to remove from inventory
Accept nothing will work perfectly and do an annual / bi-annual stocktake/audit to get everything back up to date
Personally, I use a combination of the last two. I have much less wine than your target, yet I still need that stocktake to correct my inventory.
I use my ‘bulk’ storage on the bottom for my 375ml’s. It is harder to get to, but you can put a lot in the bottom space. I use half the bulk for 375’s and the other for champagnes. I try to arrange the ones I want to drink on the top front row. I have 130 375’s- I love them when I do not want to drink too much. And, you can have more variety with friends.
If you have the time, space and tools, build your own diamond bins. I had a space between the top of my bar and the shelf above it that made a diamond bin out of using 1" by 8" pine. Works well and the bottles are recessed from the shelf. Though I intended it for 375’s, there are more 750’s in it than 375’s which also tells me, don’t dedicate space for 375’s, use something that handles both. Where I used 7" centers, you can use 9, 10 or 12 inch and buy bottle tags.
I have about 275 half bottles (mostly riesling, sauternes, burgundy, and loire stickies) and i still haven’t figured out the most efficient, secure storage. Other than sauternes, bottles slide out of diamond bins peridically.
In individual bottle or double deep racking I simply cut pieces of 1/4" plywood the width and length of the openings in the bins. They readily slide in and out, and serve to keep the 375s from dropping through the spaces intended for 750s. Generally, I’m able to get 3 splits into a double-deep bin, so you do pay about a 25% penalty in capacity…but loose 50% in single deep bins.
I don’t have a lot of 375s, and most of them do fit into my racks without slipping through. There are a few really skinny bottles (Mr. Ks) that are too small to stay put, so I wrap them with paper towels to bulk them up. If I had a lot of them I would do what Tom Halverson has done. That’s the best idea for storing 375s that I’ve ever heard.
As to CellarTracker vs. anything else, CT is the bees knees. Hard to imagine anything else coming close. I suppose if you live long enough you might accumulate $4000 in annual contributions to Eric, but the QPR is just off-the-charts fantastic. The only issue for younger guys is whether Eric has a succession plan in place, but I’m more comfortable with the stability of CT than any other Johnny-come-lately.
Hey, I’m only 45 and not planning on kicking or moving on. And unlike a few years ago, I now have a couple of fulltime employees including one who has the ability to manage pretty much any aspect of the technology.
