Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

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cjsavino
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1701 Post by cjsavino » July 19th, 2018, 10:01 am

Bruce Leiser_owitz wrote:Was this "micro-batch" hand-curated?

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#1702 Post by PeterH » July 19th, 2018, 10:10 am

Edward H. Earles wrote:Peering more closely at the label, I see that the spirit is bottled in Paris, KY, which is in the next county over (and where I lived as a toddler). There's only one distillery there (Hartfield and Company). A couple of years back I visited a tiny nanodistillery in Paris; this might be the same company, but if so it's in a different, larger building now. The firm I visited put the whiskey up in little 5-liter oak firkins, which is how the whiskey gets color after only two years of oaking. If I get a chance I'll pop over and inquire if the proprietor has a business relationship with Ray Walker.
Something like this, in other words, but a little larger.

http://www.woodinvillewhiskeyco.com/pro ... iskey-kit/
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#1703 Post by Edward H. Earles » July 19th, 2018, 10:36 am

Yes, rather like that, although their firkins weren't tapped. The proprietor told me that if I wanted some of the whiskey, he'd arrange for a third party to sell it as "white dog", along with the firkin. The time of aging would have been up to me. I passed, of course.

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#1704 Post by Wes Barton » July 19th, 2018, 12:05 pm

PeterH wrote:
Edward H. Earles wrote:Peering more closely at the label, I see that the spirit is bottled in Paris, KY, which is in the next county over (and where I lived as a toddler). There's only one distillery there (Hartfield and Company). A couple of years back I visited a tiny nanodistillery in Paris; this might be the same company, but if so it's in a different, larger building now. The firm I visited put the whiskey up in little 5-liter oak firkins, which is how the whiskey gets color after only two years of oaking. If I get a chance I'll pop over and inquire if the proprietor has a business relationship with Ray Walker.
Something like this, in other words, but a little larger.

http://www.woodinvillewhiskeyco.com/pro ... iskey-kit/
So, you send him the money. He buys the kit for your order (unless he needs cash for something else, in which case he'll keep intending to make the purchase, whenever more money magically interferes, as long as there isn't another lifestyle priority, which there always will be). Some time later, he'll get around to working on crucial legal details he didn't fully grasp before and discover he made some fundamental oversights. Things always seem to work themselves out, so he procrastinates...
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#1705 Post by T. Melloni » July 19th, 2018, 12:34 pm

large.png
L'AMÉRICAINE KENTUCKY BOURBON R W

The mark consists of a stylized version of the God (with the French "Fleur-de-lis" in his hand. Encircled by two circles, forming a boundary around him. This God is known as Hermès in Greek Mythology, and also known as Mercury in Roman mythology. The initials "R" and "W" are seen above and behind the figure. Across the top of the circle reads "L'Américaine" and across the bottom of the circle reads "Kentucky Bourbon".

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#1706 Post by ssoals » July 19th, 2018, 12:41 pm

You know Mercury is also the God of thieves and tricksters...just saying
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#1707 Post by mike basile » July 19th, 2018, 1:10 pm

ssoals wrote:You know Mercury is also the God of thieves and tricksters...just saying
Fantastic!

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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1708 Post by Karl K » July 19th, 2018, 1:30 pm

Maybe merge with MACDONALD wait list thread in case someone wants to trade their spot for that wine for your chance to invest with RW?
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#1709 Post by Dennis Borczon » July 19th, 2018, 2:01 pm

The Mercury figure is Ray flying off with your money. The Road to Bardstown indeed!

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#1710 Post by Todd F r e n c h » July 19th, 2018, 3:48 pm

Edward H. Earles wrote:Yes, rather like that, although their firkins weren't tapped. The proprietor told me that if I wanted some of the whiskey, he'd arrange for a third party to sell it as "white dog", along with the firkin. The time of aging would have been up to me. I passed, of course.
Big difference is that when the proprietor offered it to Ray, his DECADE of expertise as a Grand Cru winemaker changed and improved the 2-year Bourbon and made it artisan. If you bought from the proprietor, it would just be booze.
Apparently I'm lazy, have a narrow agenda, and offer little in the way of content and substance (RMP) (and have a "penchant for gossip" -KBI)

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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1711 Post by D@ve D y r 0 f f » July 19th, 2018, 4:07 pm

Jorge Henriquez wrote:
E2B266CD-67B1-486A-A8EC-456526349B37.png
“Napoleon Bonaparte Walker” & “Lafayette Walker”?!?!? Are we sure this is not just a script for a Family Guy episode?!?!
So James named his boys Louis, Napoleon, and Lafayette, and Ray says that TWO of them were given French names? [scratch.gif]

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#1712 Post by CWun » July 19th, 2018, 4:54 pm

he puts a vintage on the bourbon? that's not common right? usually the statement is "aged X years"
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#1713 Post by D@ve D y r 0 f f » July 19th, 2018, 4:58 pm

T. Melloni wrote:This God is known as Hermès in Greek Mythology
Did they actually put the accent grave in "Hermes" in their application? I think that gives us a clue on pricing...

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#1714 Post by CWun » July 19th, 2018, 5:11 pm

D@ve D y r 0 f f wrote:
T. Melloni wrote:This God is known as Hermès in Greek Mythology
Did they actually put the accent grave in "Hermes" in their application? I think that gives us a clue on pricing...
Yup.
I wonder if his push to market Bourbon (muri-cuh!) as something French-y will actually hurt his sales.
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#1715 Post by T. Melloni » July 19th, 2018, 6:21 pm

D@ve D y r 0 f f wrote:
T. Melloni wrote:This God is known as Hermès in Greek Mythology
Did they actually put the accent grave in "Hermes" in their application? I think that gives us a clue on pricing...
Yes. I simply copied the filing for the trademark at the US PTO.
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#1716 Post by CJ Beazley » July 19th, 2018, 6:42 pm

Here’s the Instagram account

https://www.instagram.com/lamericaine1/
It's C(raig)

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#1717 Post by CJ Beazley » July 19th, 2018, 6:51 pm

T. Melloni wrote:
D@ve D y r 0 f f wrote:
T. Melloni wrote:This God is known as Hermès in Greek Mythology
Did they actually put the accent grave in "Hermes" in their application? I think that gives us a clue on pricing...
Yes. I simply copied the filing for the trademark at the US PTO.
Looks like he also filed for a company/brand “Bremond” listed with an Oakland address.
It's C(raig)

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#1718 Post by johnr » July 19th, 2018, 8:06 pm

If you already have not seen. Apparently his camera man’s 1st hand experiences over months during and after the wine seizure and lots in sight into Ray’s SOPs.

https://mileshtaylor.com/2018/03/04/sil ... -the-game/.
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#1719 Post by Craig G » July 19th, 2018, 8:19 pm

CWun wrote:I wonder if his push to market Bourbon (muri-cuh!) as something French-y will actually hurt his sales.
I suspect his propensity to serially fuck up will hurt his sales.
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#1720 Post by ky1em!ttskus » July 19th, 2018, 8:41 pm

CWun wrote:he puts a vintage on the bourbon? that's not common right? usually the statement is "aged X years"
#gamechanger

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#1721 Post by Andrew Christiansen » July 19th, 2018, 10:18 pm

Todd...when will Ray’s Bourbon series begin?

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#1722 Post by CJ Beazley » July 20th, 2018, 5:13 am

Craig G wrote:
CWun wrote:I wonder if his push to market Bourbon (muri-cuh!) as something French-y will actually hurt his sales.
I suspect his propensity to serially fuck up will hurt his sales.
The tag line on the Instagram is “freedom fluid”.
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#1723 Post by Adam Noble » July 20th, 2018, 7:48 am

I, for one, am looking forward to Ray's bourbon posts to finally give this godforsaken bulletin board some much needed credibility and gravitas.

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#1724 Post by Edward H. Earles » July 27th, 2018, 10:49 am

I have just returned from Paris, KY, where my wife and I had a brief tour and tasting at the Hartfield & Company distillery, which was conducted by the distiller. He is a pleasant and engaging gentleman (as distillers generally are). The Bourbon is aged for 5 to 6 months in 6-gallon oak barrels. The whiskey isn't quite in the class of Buffalo Trace's products, but it tastes better than one would expect, given its short maturation time. Following the tour, I asked the distiller if his firm has a business relationship with Ray Walker. He'd never heard of him. He did confirm for me that Hartfield is the only distiller in Paris. Apparently, L'Americain doesn't actually exist yet, beyond the imagination of Mr. Walker.

I apprised the distiller of the L'Americain announcement, the Miles Taylor article, and the thread here on WB, and he was quite interested. In return, he presented me with a bit of news which may be relevant. Recently, the Paris city commission purchased the building which had served for many years as the Paris Country Club. They immediately rezoned the property into a category allowing light industrial operations, and apparently intend to flip the property for a profit. There is talk of attracting a distiller to the property. The distiller at Hartfield was perturbed by this situation; he believes (as do a number of other citizens of Paris) that the deal was "shady", at the very least, and probably illegal, as a city commission isn't supposed to engage in speculative commercial real estate ventures. He told me that, that very morning, he had contacted two of the commissioners (separately) in an effort to determine if the commissioners were in fact attempting to lure a distiller to the property. He said that both commissioners were evasive, and would not provide him with any useful information.

Is Mr. Walker in cahoots with the Paris city commission? I could not determine whether or not that was the case. If I find out anything more on this situation, I'll report it here.

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#1725 Post by Poppy Davis » July 27th, 2018, 10:55 am

Awesome report! Of course it doesn't actually exist yet! [rofl.gif] [rofl.gif] [rofl.gif]
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#1726 Post by Jim Anderson » July 27th, 2018, 11:09 am

Edward H. Earles wrote:I have just returned from Paris, KY, where my wife and I had a brief tour and tasting at the Hartfield & Company distillery, which was conducted by the distiller. He is a pleasant and engaging gentleman (as distillers generally are). The Bourbon is aged for 5 to 6 months in 6-gallon oak barrels. The whiskey isn't quite in the class of Buffalo Trace's products, but it tastes better than one would expect, given its short maturation time. Following the tour, I asked the distiller if his firm has a business relationship with Ray Walker. He'd never heard of him. He did confirm for me that Hartfield is the only distiller in Paris. Apparently, L'Americain doesn't actually exist yet, beyond the imagination of Mr. Walker.

I apprised the distiller of the L'Americain announcement, the Miles Taylor article, and the thread here on WB, and he was quite interested. In return, he presented me with a bit of news which may be relevant. Recently, the Paris city commission purchased the building which had served for many years as the Paris Country Club. They immediately rezoned the property into a category allowing light industrial operations, and apparently intend to flip the property for a profit. There is talk of attracting a distiller to the property. The distiller at Hartfield was perturbed by this situation; he believes (as do a number of other citizens of Paris) that the deal was "shady", at the very least, and probably illegal, as a city commission isn't supposed to engage in speculative commercial real estate ventures. He told me that, that very morning, he had contacted two of the commissioners (separately) in an effort to determine if the commissioners were in fact attempting to lure a distiller to the property. He said that both commissioners were evasive, and would not provide him with any useful information.

Is Mr. Walker in cahoots with the Paris city commission? I could not determine whether or not that was the case. If I find out anything more on this situation, I'll report it here.
You’re like the anti-Geraldo! You went to find something and found nothing and THAT was FAR more more interesting than if you had indeed bumped right into Ray himself! Of course it doesn’t exist! That. Was. Awesome.
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#1727 Post by Bruce Leiser_owitz » July 27th, 2018, 11:10 am

Edward H. Earles wrote:I have just returned from Paris, KY, where my wife and I had a brief tour and tasting at the Hartfield & Company distillery, which was conducted by the distiller. He is a pleasant and engaging gentleman (as distillers generally are). The Bourbon is aged for 5 to 6 months in 6-gallon oak barrels. The whiskey isn't quite in the class of Buffalo Trace's products, but it tastes better than one would expect, given its short maturation time. Following the tour, I asked the distiller if his firm has a business relationship with Ray Walker. He'd never heard of him. He did confirm for me that Hartfield is the only distiller in Paris. Apparently, L'Americain doesn't actually exist yet, beyond the imagination of Mr. Walker..
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#1728 Post by Larry Kaplan » July 27th, 2018, 11:24 am

It has to exist there is a video.....

https://vimeo.com/282013069

Although the bottle in video is not the bottle in Ray's mock up.
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#1729 Post by Edward H. Earles » July 27th, 2018, 11:37 am

Well...I don't know what to say. I will point out that the distiller at Hartfield isn't the owner, so perhaps the owner provided Mr. Walker with some Bourbon, unbeknownst to the distiller...but Hartfield is a tiny operation; they don't produce enough to fund such a slick intro video. And by the way, the opening shot of that video doesn't look like the KY horse country (I live in it), it looks like California, or maybe south Texas. Our landscape isn't that flat.

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#1730 Post by Larry Kaplan » July 27th, 2018, 11:42 am

Edward H. Earles wrote:Well...I don't know what to say. I will point out that the distiller at Hartfield isn't the owner, so perhaps the owner provided Mr. Walker with some Bourbon, unbeknownst to the distiller...but Hartfield is a tiny operation; they don't produce enough to fund such a slick intro video. And by the way, the opening shot of that video doesn't look like the KY horse country (I live in it), it looks like California, or maybe south Texas. Our landscape isn't that flat.
Sorry it was a joke of there is no way there is anything behind this.. the video is just cuts of stock video.
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#1731 Post by Siun o'Connell » July 27th, 2018, 12:01 pm

I do love the idea that a guy who was a total failure in France can bring "French refinement" to Kentucky bourbon ... as if refinement was needed, as if his "expertise" existed.

Just stunning.

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#1732 Post by Edward H. Earles » July 27th, 2018, 12:17 pm

Indeed. And I am surprised that this farce hasn't attracted the attention of larger media outlets. There is a comic movie screenplay here, just begging to be written.

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#1733 Post by scamhi » July 27th, 2018, 12:24 pm

not one of the outlets that featured Maison Ilan and the Ray Walker story has gone back to follow up on his success or total lack there of.
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#1734 Post by Todd F r e n c h » July 27th, 2018, 12:31 pm

scamhi wrote:not one of the outlets that featured Maison Ilan and the Ray Walker story has gone back to follow up on his success or total lack there of.
Yeah, that's frustrating
Apparently I'm lazy, have a narrow agenda, and offer little in the way of content and substance (RMP) (and have a "penchant for gossip" -KBI)

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#1735 Post by T. Altmayer » July 27th, 2018, 12:49 pm

scamhi wrote:not one of the outlets that featured Maison Ilan and the Ray Walker story has gone back to follow up on his success or total lack there of.
Success stories are much more fun to read and cheaper to write, especially if you just interview the source and believe everything that he says.
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#1736 Post by Wes Barton » July 27th, 2018, 12:53 pm

Our Bourbon is unique for many reasons
It's as light as air on the palate.
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#1737 Post by RichardFlack » July 27th, 2018, 8:02 pm

Jim Anderson wrote:
Edward H. Earles wrote:Peering more closely at the label, I see that the spirit is bottled in Paris, KY, which is in the next county over (and where I lived as a toddler). There's only one distillery there (Hartfield and Company). A couple of years back I visited a tiny nanodistillery in Paris; this might be the same company, but if so it's in a different, larger building now. The firm I visited put the whiskey up in little 5-liter oak firkins, which is how the whiskey gets color after only two years of oaking. If I get a chance I'll pop over and inquire if the proprietor has a business relationship with Ray Walker.
I like the on the ground investigative situation. 5 liter oak firkins? Uh, no thanks.
Surprised it's not aged in Grand Cru Burgundy barrels......

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#1738 Post by Todd F r e n c h » July 27th, 2018, 8:27 pm

RichardFlack wrote:
Jim Anderson wrote:
Edward H. Earles wrote:Peering more closely at the label, I see that the spirit is bottled in Paris, KY, which is in the next county over (and where I lived as a toddler). There's only one distillery there (Hartfield and Company). A couple of years back I visited a tiny nanodistillery in Paris; this might be the same company, but if so it's in a different, larger building now. The firm I visited put the whiskey up in little 5-liter oak firkins, which is how the whiskey gets color after only two years of oaking. If I get a chance I'll pop over and inquire if the proprietor has a business relationship with Ray Walker.
I like the on the ground investigative situation. 5 liter oak firkins? Uh, no thanks.
Surprised it's not aged in Grand Cru Burgundy barrels......
Don't think he's allowed to buy those anymore...
Apparently I'm lazy, have a narrow agenda, and offer little in the way of content and substance (RMP) (and have a "penchant for gossip" -KBI)

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#1739 Post by Edward H. Earles » July 28th, 2018, 5:22 am

On his whiskey web site, he says that his "2016 vintage" is scheduled for release in December, 2018. (Who assigns vintages to Bourbon? Maybe that's the "French Refinement" he is claiming.)

The only possibility I can see here, if he actually does have whiskey, is that he showed up at Hartfield in 2016 as a customer, and bought one or two of those 6-gallon barrels, and has been aging them at his place since then; and that he intends to bottle the Hartfield whiskey in his own bottles, and re-sell them at a no-doubt-fantastic markup from the Hartfield price.

This is, of course, assuming that he has any whiskey at all.

The label shown on his web site says, "Bottled by L'Americaine Spirits Company, Paris, KY". I can't find any mention of that company outside of Ray's web promotions.

I don't know much about the Federal legal requirements for being in the whiskey business, but I do know that Federal law forbids licensing to anyone with a felony conviction. What happened with Ray's domestic violence charge? Did that result in a felony conviction? Here's a pull quote from an article I found, on starting up a craft distillery:

"On the federal level, according to Inc.com, officials want reassurance that facilities will be secured from fire and theft. A clean background free of felonies is also required. Questions may be asked of your spouse, investors and financiers. Some of the questions can get personal so be sure before entering into the process, you have had conversations with all business partners so you won't run into any surprises."

Can we imagine that Ray has successfully passed through this process?

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#1740 Post by Jim Brennan » July 28th, 2018, 5:39 am

Maybe send the appropriate licensing authorities some reference material about Ray and his business practices?

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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1741 Post by Randy Bowman » July 28th, 2018, 8:24 pm

Ray does not have any felony "convictions." Plea deal misdemeanors. If Ray isn't paying his child support and not assisting the family, he could be charged with felony abandonment but getting the right agency to investigate is difficult and when the victim is in a foreign country, it has to go through federal red tape at somewhere between 16 and a 6th and 33 and third speed.

Consider this though. We know at least 20 people who are absentee winery owners that generally visit Napa for pick and blend/bottle. Not a lot different from going to a distillery twice a year and producing your own Bourbon or Whiskey. Marketing is the key. Salesmanship a bonus. Add a history of wine making, culinary artistry and now a touted distiller.
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1742 Post by George Hejna » July 30th, 2018, 9:45 am

new video says he has 4,000 bottles of Whiskey. Shipping soon? :)

George

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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1743 Post by Neal.Mollen » July 30th, 2018, 9:58 am

Bruce Leiser_owitz wrote:
Edward H. Earles wrote:I have just returned from Paris, KY, where my wife and I had a brief tour and tasting at the Hartfield & Company distillery, which was conducted by the distiller. He is a pleasant and engaging gentleman (as distillers generally are). The Bourbon is aged for 5 to 6 months in 6-gallon oak barrels. The whiskey isn't quite in the class of Buffalo Trace's products, but it tastes better than one would expect, given its short maturation time. Following the tour, I asked the distiller if his firm has a business relationship with Ray Walker. He'd never heard of him. He did confirm for me that Hartfield is the only distiller in Paris. Apparently, L'Americain doesn't actually exist yet, beyond the imagination of Mr. Walker..
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1744 Post by Jorge Henriquez » July 31st, 2018, 5:57 am

George Hejna wrote:new video says he has 4,000 bottles of Whiskey. Shipping soon? :)

George
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1745 Post by Neal.Mollen » July 31st, 2018, 6:06 am

Larry Kaplan wrote:It has to exist there is a video.....

https://vimeo.com/282013069

Although the bottle in video is not the bottle in Ray's mock up.
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1746 Post by scamhi » July 31st, 2018, 6:15 am

George Hejna wrote:new video says he has 4,000 bottles of Whiskey. Shipping soon? :)

George
can you cut and paste the link? Purely for entertainment purposes.
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1747 Post by Jorge Henriquez » July 31st, 2018, 6:33 am

scamhi wrote:
George Hejna wrote:new video says he has 4,000 bottles of Whiskey. Shipping soon? :)

George
can you cut and paste the link? Purely for entertainment purposes.
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1748 Post by scamhi » July 31st, 2018, 6:52 am

Jorge Henriquez wrote:
scamhi wrote:
George Hejna wrote:new video says he has 4,000 bottles of Whiskey. Shipping soon? :)

George
can you cut and paste the link? Purely for entertainment purposes.
that is not a new video...
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1749 Post by Tom Gutting » July 31st, 2018, 8:21 am

Neal.Mollen wrote:
Bruce Leiser_owitz wrote:
Edward H. Earles wrote:I have just returned from Paris, KY, where my wife and I had a brief tour and tasting at the Hartfield & Company distillery, which was conducted by the distiller. He is a pleasant and engaging gentleman (as distillers generally are). The Bourbon is aged for 5 to 6 months in 6-gallon oak barrels. The whiskey isn't quite in the class of Buffalo Trace's products, but it tastes better than one would expect, given its short maturation time. Following the tour, I asked the distiller if his firm has a business relationship with Ray Walker. He'd never heard of him. He did confirm for me that Hartfield is the only distiller in Paris. Apparently, L'Americain doesn't actually exist yet, beyond the imagination of Mr. Walker..
"Our Bourbon is unique for many reasons,"

Bruce
For one, it isn't a liquid; it is nothing but a hot gas."
Haha! That's a great one, Neal.
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Ray Walker & Maison Ilan updates - the saga has ended...(updated)

#1750 Post by scamhi » July 31st, 2018, 9:09 am

Image

Image

Image
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