Pierre Girardin : new kid on the block

Pierre Girrardin is the son of the retired Vincent Girardin and I think 2017 is his first vintage . At restaurant Atomix in NY , I tried his Puligny Montrachet Folatieres . I was really impressed : a very mineral chalky wine with nice present acidities , some florality from Puligny , great length . Already drinking beautifully . I adored the style and went out to search for more wine , once I was back in Belgium . This could become an upcoming new star , try to taste his wines and if you like it get an allocation before it’s too late .

Glad I bought some before this post!

How was Atomix?

Atomix is one of Manhattan’s best restaurants imho , I loved it . There are only 14 seats . Actually , I went there twice in one week , the first time we brought our own wines . The second time , I choose wines from their wine list .
After the Girardin, we tried the 2009 Williams Selyem ( Rochioli Riverblock vineyard ) , a delicious sweet pinot we all loved .
The 1989 Eyrie Vineyard ( chardonnay ) was past it’s prime , having lost a lot of its fruit . Not enough to send it back but this was a poor and expensive choice .
Overall , highly recommended .

Great! I will be going there soon.

Never was a fan of Vincent’s reds but they are poured often at a local wineshop… so hopefully Pierre can do better.

2017 is definitely his first vintage and just opened a brand new modern facility. I am expecting a mixed case and half of reds and whites next month. William Kelley is visiting him this fall to review his 17’s and 18’s per another discussion thread.

Is this a thing with Burgundy? What would a non-local consumer do to get one? Is pricing more favorable? How much do you have to buy?

though to be fair his whites were much better. and his reds were quite good in 1999.

From what I understand they don’t receive private customers. So I wouldn’t know how to get an allocation local or non-local.

You need to get an allocation from the importer in your country

Isn’t it a “thing” with California wineries with mailing lists? It is also a “thing” with wine retailers with small production wines from virtually everywhere in the world and their best customers. Are you asking whether highly desired small production wines get allocated?

I’m honestly just asking because I don’t know about it. Nothing negative intended by the questions.

I’ve visited a couple dozen very good producers in Italy, and I was not made aware of some allocations direct to consumers and so forth at any of them in the way that is fairly common in California and Oregon.

And after reading this board the last dozen years, I have hardly seen mention of people on direct lists from Burgundy, Bordeaux, Champagne and other European producers. Other than I’ve heard a few indirect references to things like that at the DRC / Dujac type producers, but even then nothing more than vague suggestions those channels may exist.

So humor me here, I just like to learn about things. How common are they? Are they just the super expensive producers and wines? Is it mostly for locals, or so they have international customers? Is the pricing more favorable than retail? Are you on any lists like that for overseas producers?

Chris , there are 2 different allocations . One from the producer direct and one from the importer . I am on the list from a couple of producers in Burgundy which is fun because you get to visit them once a year and taste the new vintage . Prices are not more favorable than in the home country . For example , at Roulot , Madame insisted I buy 6 bourgogne blancs and 18 other wines ( at very high prices ) in order to get one bottle of Perrieres .
More interesting is to get an allocation from the importer , in my case Belgium . I have been buying DRC or Rousseau since the late eigthies so I always get my “ allocation “ . Prices have of course increased dramatically over the years , so I stopped buying many Burgundies ( for example : Ponsot ) .

I have a friend who goes to Burgundy several times a year and has for many years. He has known a number of producers for many years and I know that he buys directly from a couple of hard to get Burgundy producers and used to buy from others (he is getting older and has cut down his purchases). I also have been told by a couple of people in Europe that they do the same. I have seen a European couple pick up wine at a winery for their yearly allocation when we were visiting the producer. I think it is not uncommon for Europeans to drive to Burgundy a couple of times a year or so to pick up their wines. Seems very similar to mailing lists in Napa. In many of these situations, both in the US and in Burgundy, the wineries are being loyal to customers who have been customers for many years including when the winery was not as well known and when selling the wine was more difficult.

I also know of people who get allocated wines by retailers in the US. They are good customers of the retailers. They often pay much lower prices for the wines than do people who buy the same wine at auction, etc.

I do not know what you mean by pricing more favorable than retail. Retail in the US? Retail in Burgundy? Retail as in on a price list at the winery? What is retail at Screaming Eagle or Harlan or something like that - the mailing list price or the price retail stores charge in the US or the auction prices for those who flip wines? Think of the price at wineries as the mailing list price, although at most California wineries where the wines are not allocated the winery price is higher than retail in stores - that is not the case in my experience in Burgundy where the winery price is generally lower than the price at stores.

I often purchase wine from producers when I visit producers in Burgundy. In fact, I virtually always ask to buy wines from the producers - I mean, after they spent an hour of so with me and gave me lots of wines to taste, it would be rude and obnoxious not to do so. I feel differently in wine regions like Napa where I pay to taste. If I pay to taste, I do not feel an obligation to buy.

Historically, most Burgundy producers that did not sell all their wines to negociants probably sold some of their wine straight out of the winery. Today, some of the producers I visit tell me that they have no wines to sell. Others have wine to sell and sell wine to me and others who come to the door. The prices I pay are the prices others pay buying wines directly from the winery. They generally are much lower than US prices given our three tier system. When I was in Burgundy a year ago, I bought directly from four of nine producers I visited, although one place limited how much I could buy. The others did not have wine at the winery to sell me but a few sent me to the local Caveaux where I bought some of their wine. I bought from the others in the US.

A couple of points to add to Herwig:

  • I also feel a lot of pressure from producers to align the price ex-cellar for private persons with long standing allocations with the price importers pay (or even higher). Roulot has gone up significantly, as has Leflaive when the new gérant took over years ago (i think the price doubled from one year to the other). I am sure there are many like that. It is true that 10 years ago, there could be a lot of difference between the ex-cellar for private persons with allocations and the retail price. Less so now, although it can still be the case for “classic estates” eg Coche, Lafarge.
  • Yes, Europeans with a long history in the region often have allocations, but there has been some pressure to reduce them in favor of importers or new markets (China?). Herwig, not sure whether you have also seen this? Allocations going down in low yield year and then not going up so much afterwards. Europeans = mostly from surrounding countries, like Belgium, Netherlands, Switzerland, etc (personally never seen a German in a Burgundian cellar, but that’s probably more coincidence than anything else).

Thanks all of you for explaining that. Very interesting peek into a world I know nothing about.

Disclaimer: offer of 2017 Pierre Girardin

For those living in the Netherlands and wanting to buy 2017 Pierre Girardin, I can offer 1.176 bottles divided over:

Bourgogne blanc Eclat de Calcaire
Meursault Grands Charrons
Meursault les Narvaux
Meursault Tillets
Puligny-Montrachet les Folatières
Bourgogne rouge Eclat de Calcaire
Volnay
Pommard
Monthelie rouge 1er cru les Clous
Beaune 1er cru Epenottes
Volnay 1er cru Clos des Chênes
Pommard 1er cru les Charmots
Pommard 1er cru Epenots

End of sales pitch, completely without obligation…!

Just went to an industry thing and some of his wines were featured. Agree with OP’s opinion of th Puligny-Montrachet Folatieres. Liked several of the wines of wines. His Bourgogne Rouge Eclat de Calcaire would be a very good value if they had any to sell. Also impressed by the Corton Charlie and the Volnay, among others. Will be watching these wines going forward.

Oh, and he is only 21 years old.