US 25% tariff on European wines; 100% "digital" tariff on French products called off for the moment

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Michel Abood
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1101 Post by Michel Abood » January 14th, 2020, 7:00 pm

Nola Palomar wrote:
January 14th, 2020, 4:27 pm
I have not had this degree of anxiety for many months...
As I've discovered, sleep is WAY overrated... [snort.gif]
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1102 Post by RichardFlack » January 14th, 2020, 7:15 pm

I’m not sure why people blame companies for taking legal steps to minimise their taxes under the various tax rules which apply. The fault lies with countries that set the rules (usually with the hope of attracting investment of some kind, not always realised).

So governments take steps to redress the balance. Good. And if corporations take unreasonable steps to lobby against the adjustments then they should be criticised.

The problem is the way countries compete for investment. Tax credits, subsidies, soft loans etc. Not sure how one can stop that. Tariffs are a terrible way of doing it because of the collateral damage to imposing country. International agreements are the way to do it in theory. But with countries like the US tearing up international agreements and institutions it’s going to be difficult.

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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1103 Post by Brian G r a f s t r o m » January 14th, 2020, 8:24 pm

G. D y e r wrote:
January 14th, 2020, 8:17 am
Presuming this tariff isn't resolved, where do our dollars and importers go?

I suspect I'll probably investigate WA and OR wines more deeply. Not because they're equivalent to French and Italian wines, but for the sake of variety.

Importers probably will have to focus on South America if they have a hope of survival and, to a lesser extend, Australia and New Zealand. But again, that is not a 1-to-1 swap for European wines.

All of this is bad news, from the industry down to consumers' freedom of choice, but even as a consumer I need to think about contingencies.
A market that I think is terribly under-represented is South Africa. I'll continue to buy from the few American producers I already buy from. I may try some American producers I've long been telling myself I want to try, but simply never have.

I think we'll see an uptick in auction offerings and purchases (I imagine the tariffs would be a boon to auction sellers).

I've been buying more than normal the past couple of months, preparing for what would be a screeching halt to most of my purchasing if the 100% tariffs hit.

Finally, I figure this will be a great opportunity to drink down our cellar somewhat --- it's finally starting to offer some maturity, and we *do* have too many holdings in certain areas.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1104 Post by Nola Palomar » January 14th, 2020, 9:50 pm

From one the shipping companies I work with.
January 14, 2020

EU Tariff Updates

Here is a quick recap of the tariff updates and a thank you for all who reached out and to members who submitted comments.

France / Digital Service Tax – public hearings were held last week, it is now up to the US Trade Representative Office to make a determination.

EU Tariffs / Civil Aircraft Subsidies – public comment period closed, moves to public hearings.

The US Trade Office released a joint statement today after Robert Lighthizer met with the Trade Ministers of The European Union (Phil Hogan) and Japan to discuss industrial subsidies and ways to strengthen WTO rules around subsidies and countervailing measures.

We will continue to share any new developments in this situation, and as always for any questions on your shipments or logistics alternatives in this current regulatory environment, please contact our shipping partner Hillebrand for more information.


© North American Shippers Association (NASA) 2147 Route 27, Edison New Jersey 08817 USA
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1105 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 15th, 2020, 4:19 am

RichardFlack wrote:
January 14th, 2020, 7:15 pm
I’m not sure why people blame companies for taking legal steps to minimise their taxes under the various tax rules which apply. The fault lies with countries that set the rules (usually with the hope of attracting investment of some kind, not always realised).

So governments take steps to redress the balance. Good. And if corporations take unreasonable steps to lobby against the adjustments then they should be criticised.

The problem is the way countries compete for investment. Tax credits, subsidies, soft loans etc. Not sure how one can stop that. Tariffs are a terrible way of doing it because of the collateral damage to imposing country. International agreements are the way to do it in theory. But with countries like the US tearing up international agreements and institutions it’s going to be difficult.
Just be aware that the EU continues to subsidize Airbus. This is not just an American issue.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1106 Post by RichardFlack » January 15th, 2020, 5:26 am

Yes the subsidy / soft taxes etc are very definitely a global issue. I thought that’s what I was saying. But, for example, the destruction of the WTO is a US initiative. And the US is fighting the attempt to better tax tech companies.

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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1107 Post by Markus S » January 15th, 2020, 5:31 am

RichardFlack wrote:
January 15th, 2020, 5:26 am
Yes the subsidy / soft taxes etc are very definitely a global issue. I thought that’s what I was saying. But, for example, the destruction of the WTO is a US initiative. And the US is fighting the attempt to better tax tech companies.
Yes, let's call the kettle black where it needs to be called.
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#1108 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 15th, 2020, 5:53 am

The destruction of the WTO (by the U.S.) is a complete cluster-f***. That being said, it's a much deeper (way more political) discussion than we can have here.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1109 Post by AndrewH » January 15th, 2020, 8:53 am

D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
January 15th, 2020, 4:19 am
RichardFlack wrote:
January 14th, 2020, 7:15 pm
I’m not sure why people blame companies for taking legal steps to minimise their taxes under the various tax rules which apply. The fault lies with countries that set the rules (usually with the hope of attracting investment of some kind, not always realised).

So governments take steps to redress the balance. Good. And if corporations take unreasonable steps to lobby against the adjustments then they should be criticised.

The problem is the way countries compete for investment. Tax credits, subsidies, soft loans etc. Not sure how one can stop that. Tariffs are a terrible way of doing it because of the collateral damage to imposing country. International agreements are the way to do it in theory. But with countries like the US tearing up international agreements and institutions it’s going to be difficult.
Just be aware that the EU continues to subsidize Airbus. This is not just an American issue.

It's a Chinese issue?


As a consumer of airplanes, via flights, I'm happy to have United, American, Delta, etc. purchase airplanes that are cheaper than they otherwise would be because of subsidies from the EU - presumably some portion of those savings are passed along to me in the form of lower ticket prices. So should consumers in the rest of the world welcome the subsidies. The only claim of harm from subsidies is made by Airbus's competitors, which right now is Boeing (and may eventually include Comac) and its shareholders. I'm really not worried that Boeing is going to go out of business because it has to lower prices in order to remain an effective competitor to Airbus (though they may go out of business because of their 737Max decisions).
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1110 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 15th, 2020, 9:18 am

When Boeing's supply chain starts laying off people due to reduced sales (as is already happening because of the Max) then it's not so much happiness about cheaper tickets.

I don't want to go further down this road in Wine Talk.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1111 Post by Nola Palomar » January 17th, 2020, 2:34 pm

Latest news from the NASA
North American Shippers Association (NASA)

January 17, 2020

EU Tariff Update – No further hearings

We have received a clarification that the US Trade Representative office will NOT be holding additional hearings related to the tariffs in the Civil Aircraft Subsidies. The USTR advised our industry coalition partner DISCUS that they view the two previous hearings in the dispute are sufficient.

We have no further information on the timing of announcements of the final products, origins or tariffs rates, but the USTR is limited to the products/origins published on July 5, 2019 (which includes all wine types from all 28 EU member nations along with spirits, cordials and liquors).

Tariff action is subject to Section 301 of the Trade Act of 1974 statues and practices which provides for a period review and revision of the retaliation list by the USTR. In the aircraft subsidies dispute, unless there is an agreement reached or other legal exception, the schedule calls for review within 120 days of the start of the retaliation, and then every 180 days thereafter. The changeable nature of this retaliation tariff is known as “carousel retaliation.”

The 25% tariffs on specified EU products/origins went into effect October 18th, 2019. If, again this is a big “if” because they technically can do it anytime, they review within 120 days from the original tariff posting, that would put us around the week of February 17, 2020.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1112 Post by Tim Heaton » January 17th, 2020, 2:38 pm

thank you, Nola!
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1113 Post by Dan Kravitz » January 17th, 2020, 6:02 pm

As mentioned, the additional tariffs can go into effect at any time. The only thing legally required is the signature of the President on the appropriate piece of paper. A period of 120 days from the previous imposition is customary but not mandatory.

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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1114 Post by Mike Reff » January 17th, 2020, 6:28 pm

Well this is positive

https://www.latribune.fr/technos-medias ... 37457.html

To avoid a trade war between the European Union and the United States, the Minister of Economy and Finance says he is ready to "make concessions" on the French Gafa tax against Donald Trump. The objective: to bring Americans into the ranks at the OECD, where an international reform of digital taxation is being negotiated. Verdict next Wednesday in Davos.

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#1115 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 17th, 2020, 6:53 pm

That is good news, though it does not fix the potential increase on the Airbus tariffs.
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#1116 Post by Jud Reis » January 18th, 2020, 7:47 am

Be prepared for a boatload of ups and downs and back and forth in the course of this negotiation. The very definition of a fluid situation.

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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1117 Post by D@ve D y r 0 f f » January 18th, 2020, 8:01 am

With this administration, any kind of multi-lateral agreement or organization is starting with one hand tied behind its back, in terms of being the ultimate solution, unfortunately. That being said, I’m hopeful if not optimistic that we will hold off on any increases while negotiations continue, and that they will succeed - both in avoiding the proposed increases, and in rolling back the exiting 25% tariff, not to mention addressing the aircraft situation.

Putting my wine glass down for a moment, anything that can help Boeing survive and compete down the road as it tries to recover from the massive bullet wound it has in its own foot (heck, feet) is also good, especially for the US. It would be disastrous on many levels if they (or even “just” their civil aircraft division) were to disappear, as unlikely as that would have seemed only a short while ago...
Last edited by D@ve D y r 0 f f on January 18th, 2020, 9:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1118 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 18th, 2020, 8:36 am

Boeing isn’t going anywhere.

Going to be a rough stretch until the Max (or whatever they re-brand it as) gets back on line, but the company will still be there, and still be the giant.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1119 Post by John Morris » January 18th, 2020, 10:36 am

Brian G r a f s t r o m wrote:
January 14th, 2020, 8:24 pm
A market that I think is terribly under-represented is South Africa.
+1
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1120 Post by Craig G » January 19th, 2020, 8:08 pm

LOL. Damien Barton at K&L’s Fete du Bordeaux tonight:

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#1121 Post by John Morris » January 19th, 2020, 8:17 pm

Here's a pretty dramatic statistic, tweeted by the American Association of Wine Economists, based on government data.

Note that there is a bigger-than-normal spike in October 2019, and then a much bigger-than-normal falloff in November. You'd expect seasonality here because of Thanksgiving and Christmas -- wines will be landed in October and early November. And that's what you see in prior years, but not such large month-to-month fluctuations.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1122 Post by Nola Palomar » January 20th, 2020, 3:45 am

Here is a very interesting and informative article on the tariffs from an Italian perspective.
On the other hand, the numbers of the Vinitaly Nomisma Wine Monitor Observatory explain how the new heavier duties would impact the sector. “One must consider that, thanks to the stocks accumulated in previous months, French still wines subjected to the extra duty of 25%, recorded a 36% drop in sales in value in the United States in November alone, compared to the same month in 2018”, said the director of Veronafiere Giovanni Mantovani, emphasizing that, according to the Observatory,” Italy (up until now safe from duties, ed.) closed the month at a growth of almost 10%. Now, with the disaster of possible additional taxes, domestic production will not be able to meet demands and Europe will therefore risk losing market shares that will be difficult to recover in the future, thus benefiting of the New World production.
...
In other words, diplomacy has finally put itself in a clear and massive way to avoid a measure that would be catastrophic for the sector. According to various estimates, it would cost the US trade more than 10 billion dollars in revenues, and from the first estimates, such as those of the Italian Wine Union, would cost Italian wine producers no less than 200 million euros.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1123 Post by Ron Erickson » January 20th, 2020, 8:22 am

John Morris wrote:
January 19th, 2020, 8:17 pm
Here's a pretty dramatic statistic, tweeted by the American Association of Wine Economists, based on government data.

Note that there is a bigger-than-normal spike in October 2019, and then a much bigger-than-normal falloff in November. You'd expect seasonality here because of Thanksgiving and Christmas -- wines will be landed in October and early November. And that's what you see in prior years, but not such large month-to-month fluctuations.
Hmmm.... The chart looks very similar to the amount of sales tax I've paid on wine purchases recently.

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#1124 Post by Scot H. » January 20th, 2020, 11:03 am

Macron just tweeted: “ Great discussion with @realDonaldTrump on digital tax. We will work together on a good agreement to avoid tariff escalation.”
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#1125 Post by rob klafter » January 20th, 2020, 11:53 am

https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/arti ... rough-2020

Macron trump agree to no tariffs in digital tax truce through 2020
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#1126 Post by rob klafter » January 20th, 2020, 11:55 am

rob klafter wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 11:53 am
https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/arti ... rough-2020

Macron trump agree to no tariffs in digital tax truce through 2020

champagne.gif
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1127 Post by jason stein » January 20th, 2020, 12:04 pm

rob klafter wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 11:53 am
https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/arti ... rough-2020

Macron trump agree to no tariffs in digital tax truce through 2020
This is great news. However, the potential tariffs over the Airbus dispute remain, right?
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1128 Post by Troy Stark » January 20th, 2020, 12:21 pm

jason stein wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:04 pm
This is great news. However, the potential tariffs over the Airbus dispute remain, right?
I'm reading this as no new tariffs in either case. I am guessing the current 25% tariffs will remain in place until the new trade accord is signed.
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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1129 Post by John Morris » January 20th, 2020, 12:34 pm

FYI, I updated the thread heading in case anyone is confused.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1130 Post by Dennis Borczon » January 20th, 2020, 1:22 pm

well, well, it seems that Macron does have a bit of a soft spot and is willing to defer to the OECD. I guess he is having his hands full with the transit workers strike and doesn't want a lot of grape farmers parking tractors on the paris peripherique. Davos man is evolving!

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#1131 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 20th, 2020, 1:27 pm

Helps the digital tax case, but not the reevaluation of the Airbus case:

https://www.federalregister.gov/documen ... ft-dispute
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#1132 Post by Hank Victor » January 20th, 2020, 1:44 pm

Phew
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1133 Post by Nola Palomar » January 20th, 2020, 1:45 pm

Troy Stark wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:21 pm
jason stein wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:04 pm
This is great news. However, the potential tariffs over the Airbus dispute remain, right?
I'm reading this as no new tariffs in either case. I am guessing the current 25% tariffs will remain in place until the new trade accord is signed.
Please quote where you see this as I am not seeing it. I am reading this a France and US not the EU Airbus dispute.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1134 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 20th, 2020, 1:48 pm

Troy Stark wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:21 pm
jason stein wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:04 pm
This is great news. However, the potential tariffs over the Airbus dispute remain, right?
I'm reading this as no new tariffs in either case. I am guessing the current 25% tariffs will remain in place until the new trade accord is signed.
That is incorrect.

Now it would be diplomatic dirty pool to say "no new tariffs" in one case, and instead just impose them based on the other case, but we know who we are dealing with so...
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#1135 Post by John Morris » January 20th, 2020, 2:17 pm

D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 1:48 pm
Troy Stark wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:21 pm
jason stein wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:04 pm
This is great news. However, the potential tariffs over the Airbus dispute remain, right?
I'm reading this as no new tariffs in either case. I am guessing the current 25% tariffs will remain in place until the new trade accord is signed.
That is incorrect.

Now it would be diplomatic dirty pool to say "no new tariffs" in one case, and instead just impose them based on the other case, but we know who we are dealing with so...
I'm confused, are you saying the 25% tariffs are being taken off? Neither the Bloomberg story nor the NY Times story mention the October tariffs. They only mention the proposed French tax on digital businesses and the proposed retaliation by the US. Since the $7 billion/25% tariffs in October were authorized by the WTO, I can't imagine we're halting them without getting something in exchange.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1136 Post by Scot H. » January 20th, 2020, 3:18 pm

Nola Palomar wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 1:45 pm
Please quote where you see this as I am not seeing it. I am reading this a France and US not the EU Airbus dispute.
Seems like there is going to be some confusion as this is sorted. But this is from another article:

https://www.scmp.com/news/world/europe/ ... ax-dispute

"The two countries will continue negotiations along with their European partners until the end of 2020 to agree on a global framework that ensures tech companies pay an appropriate amount of tax, the diplomat said."
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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1137 Post by Al Osterheld » January 20th, 2020, 3:46 pm

The 100% tariffs proposed for French products was in response to France jumping the gun on OECD deliberations about a multinational framework for digital services taxes. The quote that "the two countries will continue negotiations along with their European partners . . ." refers to Macron's decision to not implement their own digital services tax outside the framework the OECD is still debating.

The Airbus-related tariff on EU products is entirely separate, no reason to think they would be removed based on a US-France negotiated settlement.

-Al

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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1138 Post by Jud Reis » January 20th, 2020, 3:53 pm

Be prepared for a boatload of ups and downs and back and forth. This is not over until it is over and will remain fluid and uncertain. I know that uncertainty stinks for business owners, but that is the way trade policy is being made at the moment.

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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1139 Post by Nola Palomar » January 20th, 2020, 4:05 pm

Scot H. wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 3:18 pm
Nola Palomar wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 1:45 pm
Please quote where you see this as I am not seeing it. I am reading this a France and US not the EU Airbus dispute.
Seems like there is going to be some confusion as this is sorted. But this is from another article:

https://www.scmp.com/news/world/europe/ ... ax-dispute

"The two countries will continue negotiations along with their European partners until the end of 2020 to agree on a global framework that ensures tech companies pay an appropriate amount of tax, the diplomat said."
Al Osterheld wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 3:46 pm
The 100% tariffs proposed for French products was in response to France jumping the gun on OECD deliberations about a multinational framework for digital services taxes. The quote that "the two countries will continue negotiations along with their European partners . . ." refers to Macron's decision to not implement their own digital services tax outside the framework the OECD is still debating.

The Airbus-related tariff on EU products is entirely separate, no reason to think they would be removed based on a US-France negotiated settlement.

-Al
Correct Al.

That is specifically about the Digital Use Taxes. France was the first to impose the tax on digital services, but many other EU countries were planning on following suit. It has nothing to do with the tariffs for the Airbus subsidies.

To be clear, the Digital Tax dispute include numerous French ONLY products including cheese, yogurt, beauty supplies, handbags, china(and many more) and yes, one HTS code for wine, Sparkling Wine made from grapes from France aka Champagne. All of the products would have been subject to 100% Value Added Tariff
HTS 2204.10.00 Sparkling Wine made from grapes . The same HTS code is also listed in the 100% tariff below.

The current Wine Tariff that started in October was for Airbus, and has many other products other than wine...

Part 3—Products of Germany, Spain, or the United Kingdom described below are subject to additional import duties of 25 percent ad valorem:
1509.10.20 Virgin olive oil and its fractions, whether or not refined, not chemically modified, weighing with the immediate container under 18 kg.
1509.90.20 Olive oil, other than virgin olive oil, and its fractions, not chemically modified, weighing with the immediate container under 18 kg.

Part 10—Products of France, Germany, Spain or the United Kingdom described below are subject to additional import duties of 25 percent ad valorem:
2204.21.50 Wine other than Tokay (not carbonated), not over 14% alcohol, in containers not over 2 liters.

Part 14—Products of Germany, Ireland, Italy, Spain, or the United Kingdom described below are subject to additional import duties of 25 percent ad valorem:
2208.70.00 Liqueurs and cordials

Section 1—The products that are described in Section 1 of this Annex are being considered for additional import duties if they are the product of France, Germany, Spain or the United Kingdom Would be subject to the additional import duties at 100 percent ad valorem.

Section 2—The products that are described in Section 2 of this Annex are being considered for additional import duties if they are the product of Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Ireland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Netherlands, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, or the United Kingdom. The following are the additional import duties at 100 percent ad valorem.

1509.10.40 Virgin olive oil and its fractions, whether or not refined, not chemically modified, weighing with the immediate container 18 kg or over.
1509.90.40 Olive oil, other than virgin olive oil, and its fractions, not chemically modified, weighing with the immediate container 18 kg or over.


2204.10.00 Sparkling wine, made from grapes.
2204.21.20 Effervescent grape wine, in containers holding 2 liters or less.
2204.21.30 Tokay wine (not carbonated) not over 14% alcohol, in containers not over 2 liters.
2204.21.60 “Marsala” wine, over 14% vol. alcohol, in containers holding 2 liters or less.
2204.21.80 Grape wine, other than “Marsala”, not sparkling or effervescent, over 14% vol. alcohol, in containers holding 2 liters or less.
2204.22.20 Wine of fresh grapes of an alcoholic strength by volume <=14% in containers holding <2 liters but not >10 liters.
2204.22.40 Wine of fresh grapes of an alcoholic strength by volume >14%, in containers holding <2 liters but not >10 liters.
2204.22.60 Wine of fresh grapes of an alcoholic strength by volume <=14% in containers holding >10 liters.
2204.22.80 Wine of fresh grapes of an alcoholic strength by volume >14% in containers holding >10 liters.
2204.29.61 Wine of fresh grapes of an alcoholic strength by volume <=14% in containers holding >10 liters.
2204.29.81 Wine of fresh grapes of an alcoholic strength by volume >14% in containers holding >10 liters.
2204.30.00 Grape must, nesoi, in fermentation or with fermentation arrested otherwise than by addition of alcohol.
2208.20.20 Grape brandy, excluding pisco and singani, in containers not over 4 liters, not over $2.38/liter.
2208.20.30 Grape brandy, excluding pisco and singani, in containers not over 4 liters, valued over $2.38 to $3.43/liter.
2208.20.40 Grape brandy, excluding pisco and singani, in containers not over 4 liters, valued over $3.43/liter.
2208.20.50 Grape brandy, excluding pisco and singani, in containers over 4 liters, not over $2.38/liter.
2208.20.60 Grape brandy, excluding pisco and singani, in containers over 4 liters, over $2.38/liter.
2208.30.60 Whiskies, other than Irish and Scotch whiskies.


This is not a complete list by any stretch of the imagination, just a snippet.
Jud Reis wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 3:53 pm
Be prepared for a boatload of ups and downs and back and forth. This is not over until it is over and will remain fluid and uncertain. I know that uncertainty stinks for business owners, but that is the way trade policy is being made at the moment.
I'm hanging on Jud.
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Re: US to impose 25% — and now 100% — tariff on European wine, cheese, etc.

#1140 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 20th, 2020, 4:13 pm

John Morris wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 2:17 pm
D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 1:48 pm
Troy Stark wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:21 pm


I'm reading this as no new tariffs in either case. I am guessing the current 25% tariffs will remain in place until the new trade accord is signed.
That is incorrect.

Now it would be diplomatic dirty pool to say "no new tariffs" in one case, and instead just impose them based on the other case, but we know who we are dealing with so...
I'm confused, are you saying the 25% tariffs are being taken off? Neither the Bloomberg story nor the NY Times story mention the October tariffs. They only mention the proposed French tax on digital businesses and the proposed retaliation by the US. Since the $7 billion/25% tariffs in October were authorized by the WTO, I can't imagine we're halting them without getting something in exchange.
Not saying that at all. Nothing close to that. We ARE still at risk for escalated tariffs in the Airbus case.
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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1141 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 20th, 2020, 4:15 pm

Al Osterheld wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 3:46 pm
The 100% tariffs proposed for French products was in response to France jumping the gun on OECD deliberations about a multinational framework for digital services taxes. The quote that "the two countries will continue negotiations along with their European partners . . ." refers to Macron's decision to not implement their own digital services tax outside the framework the OECD is still debating.

The Airbus-related tariff on EU products is entirely separate, no reason to think they would be removed based on a US-France negotiated settlement.

-Al
And there’s still a significant chance that the Airbus tariffs are increased and expanded in scope.
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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1142 Post by Dan Kravitz » January 20th, 2020, 4:42 pm

Aw shit. I only skimmed the headline at first.

Great for LVMH.

Not so good for us peons.

I've been waiting for Trump to declare that Tiffany's is a strategic American industry and block the takeover, guess that's not happening.

Back to interesting times.

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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1143 Post by John Morris » January 20th, 2020, 4:46 pm

D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 4:15 pm
And there’s still a significant chance that the Airbus tariffs are increased and expanded in scope.
Do you mean on the US side? Or by the EU when they get a ruling on their case against Boeing? I thought the October tariffs totaled $7 billion, the amount authorized by the WTO?
"But they told me there would be a hand basket."

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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1144 Post by Michel Abood » January 20th, 2020, 4:46 pm

As someone with Champagne on the water, I am slightly relieved. This only resolved one issue (the DST), there is still risk of 100% on ALL wines from the EU, including Champagne, for the Airbus issue. So they just removed one nuke, the other one is still hanging over our heads.

Fun times.
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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1145 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 20th, 2020, 4:51 pm

John Morris wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 4:46 pm
D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 4:15 pm
And there’s still a significant chance that the Airbus tariffs are increased and expanded in scope.
Do you mean on the US side? Or by the EU when they get a ruling on their case against Boeing? I thought the October tariffs totaled $7 billion, the amount authorized by the WTO?
On the US side.

https://ustr.gov/sites/default/files/en ... ispute.pdf
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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1146 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 20th, 2020, 4:52 pm

John,

Your revised thread title is now misleading (or at least hopefully premature).
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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1147 Post by John Morris » January 20th, 2020, 4:53 pm

I think that's fine as a heading. It's called off for the moment.
"But they told me there would be a hand basket."

"I'm not slurring my words. I'm speaking cursive."

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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1148 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 20th, 2020, 4:58 pm

The sword of Damocles is still hanging.
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Re: US to impose 25% tariff on many European wines; but 100% tariff called off

#1149 Post by John Morris » January 20th, 2020, 5:09 pm

D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 4:51 pm
John Morris wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 4:46 pm
D@vid Bu3ker wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 4:15 pm
And there’s still a significant chance that the Airbus tariffs are increased and expanded in scope.
Do you mean on the US side? Or by the EU when they get a ruling on their case against Boeing? I thought the October tariffs totaled $7 billion, the amount authorized by the WTO?
On the US side.

https://ustr.gov/sites/default/files/en ... ispute.pdf
I see. So we (the US) has served notice we might impose 100% duties on the things already subject to the 25% tariff as part of the Airbus dispute? I missed that in the discussion.

Subject heading revised.
"But they told me there would be a hand basket."

"I'm not slurring my words. I'm speaking cursive."

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Re: US 25% tariff on European wines; 100% "digital" tariff on French products called off for the moment

#1150 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » January 20th, 2020, 5:12 pm

Yeah. It’s the gut punch.

As I was trying (poorly it turns out) to say above, hopefully the US doesn’t give with one hand (suspending the digital tax tariffs) and take with the other (expansion of Airbus tariffs).

I am still very worried.
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