TN: You're Copain...You Probably Think This Song is About You...

This week we’ve tried a couple of different 2010 Copain Syrahs:

2010 Copain Syrah, Brosseau Vineyard, Chalone - Clear dark purple in the glass. Intense, somewhat brambly blackberry and boysenberry nose, a bit of smoke and spice, but mostly it’s about the jammy fruit, and a light whiff of alcohol (listed at 12.9%). On the palate, the juicy, boysenberry and blackberry fruit dominate, with a bit of spice, and a little dried jamminess along with a tinge of alcohol. The texture on this wine is nicely rounded now, and while there isn’t a lot of complexity, there also doesn’t seem to be much acid or tannin remaining to carry it through. A tasty enough wine, but nothing really inspiring. Approx…85-86.

2010 Copain, Syrah, Halcon Vineyard, Yorkville Highlands - More of a dark, blood red, as opposed to the purple of the Brosseau. The aromas sort of follow suit, a bit brighter and more raspberry here, a light touch of smoke and spice. This wine is a bit more Rhonish on the nose. The raspberry fruit carries through in the mouth, a bit more jammy than the nose suggests, and a bit less interesting. You get some light spice, clove, and smoke accents, but again this one is mostly about the fruit. There’s more acid and structure here, but still not much complexity, and the wine tastes more like a solid Zin blend. Approx…86-87.

I liked both of these on release and thought they would benefit with some cellar time, but they really haven’t done much. I cut my wine teeth on the CA wines of the late '80s and early '90s, and loved the old Ridge and Ravenswood wines, for example, before they got too oaky and boozy, but drifted to other areas after moving to Portland in 1995. While I’ve had some CA producers that have still impressed me over the years (Swan, ESJ, Laurel Glen, etc.), many of my forays there just don’t live up to the price, the hype, or the chase. I’m very intrigued by some of the new CA producers I’ve read about on the board here, including Dirty & Rowdy, Desire Lines, Cabot, Jolie-Laide, and a few more. But my question is if any of these producers are going to make wines that develop any complexity and depth beyond simple fruit? I can’t see paying $35-40 for a CA Rhone that doesn’t do anything but stay fruity and simple its whole life. I can find things for half the price from France or Italy that offer more enjoyment and complexity (even when young) but I also want to be open-minded and try new things that might be of interest and that I might like. Any contenders, or should I just stick to my old, tired ways?

+1 for your title [cheers.gif]

How about
Co-Pain
Goin’ round my brain…

Thanks for the great notes! I was thinking about buying the 2005 Copain Yorkville Highlands Syrah, but probably wont after reading. Will stick with Desire Lines and Tensley

Marshall, I am glad to see you posting. And with the same style.
Brings back memories of WCWN. And HdR (I seem to remember meeting you there many many years ago).

Thanks, Mitch. I was at HDR around 2003-2005 I think, and pretty sure we met at one of the the get-togethers/BBQs at the hotel. As for my “style”…that’s always been a matter of personal taste, I guess. champagne.gif

It must have been 2003. I think that was the year Peter Cargasacchi slept it off under the truck after the hotel backyard party. That was our third and last trip. In '01 my wife came out with me and I behaved.
In '02 if I have my years right I got myself into one fiasco after another including a drunken dropping of a wash rag down the toilet resulting in a 2:00 am call to the motel management when the entire room flooded and capped off with a drunken hold-the-paddle-up Rudy style on a half barrel of Carlisle/Novy syrah. Learning that I could not be trusted, Lynn came back out with me in '03 and that party was a blast. I think the backyard cookout got outlawed not long after that. Sorry for the thread hi-jack. I posted about whether anyone was still buying Copain two weeks ago and got crickets other than a very kind PM by a former buyer.

I have generally found that the Copain reds don’t hit extra gears of complexity with more age, unfortunately, including their flagship pinots. They don’t fall apart or go way downhill, either, but I can’t honestly say I’ve seen one where I’d say it got better from 3-5 years old to 10-14 years old.

No apologies necessary…I never mind threads drifting off. The remembrances are fun!

Thanks, Chris. That was definitely my experience with the older wines, but I was hoping that Wells’ more restrained style later might have produced wines that evolved more. Oh well, that’s why we experiment with things, right? Do you have any newer CA producers that you like that you feel will reward cellaring?

I went through a bunch of the older Copain Pinots last year that I picked up on WineBid. I found the pre-2006 (the older, bolder style) to be overall better than the more restrained style of the 2006s and 2007s. All of the 2000 vintage bottles that I tried were outstanding.

Chris - I hadn’t thought about the notion of Copain not improving or hitting “extra gears of complexity with more age” until you commented on it, but as I reflect on it I think you’re spot on. I’ve had a number of very good Copains over the years but, going through my notes, it seems like the majority of them were young and the older ones commonly got notated as being a bit more “simplistic” than I had hoped. This is not to say that I haven’t had older delicious bottles (the '06 Cerise, '09 Monument Tree, and '09 Wentzel are all recent examples over the last ~2 years or so that I was quite enamored with), but none of them seemed to be “improving” with age…instead they all seemed young still and had great underlying material.

I think I’m going to start gripping and ripping some more Copain over the near/short term now that you’ve given me this epiphany…thanks? [tease.gif]

Yeah this is interesting. A year or so ago we popped a 2007 Kiser En Haut Pinot side by side a 2007 Littorai The Haven… The Copain was the weaker of the two. It just felt… one-demensional? Littorai and Rhys of that age have generally been delicious but with an added edge and complexity. Based on my experience and what you all are describing, seems like the Copains aren’t getting there.

What about Co-pan, try again.

Marshall, thank you for the notes. The 2010 Brosseau, for a very long time, was a wine I considered one of the best Syrahs that Wells ever made. When that wine came out, I tasted it from with Wells in 2011 at the winery and it was chocked full of intense structure, blue fruit, really pretty amazing. I’ve since drank just short of a case of it, with the most recent being in 2018, so about two years ago, and then prior to that, another 3 years. This timing was intentional, as I wanted the wine to age. Both of these TNs are below, to add to your discussion.

As for the 2010 Halcon, I finished my final bottle in 2018 and thought it had some decent structure left. I also put that note below.

To the point about the wines improving with age, I do think the 2012s will do that, and I still have some 2006s left to open when I can share them. But overall, I have never let much of my wine age all that long, and have found many really delicious bottles that Wells made that I have just drank through the last several years. I do think it would be very instructive to do some comparison tastings of the range, going back a ways but I am not sure that is possible anymore.

  • 2010 Copain Syrah Halcon Vineyard - USA, California, North Coast, Yorkville Highlands (9/24/2018)
    Drank one of these 3 months ago, which came off kind of boring to me. Figured I’d try my final bottle last night, as I wanted something that if I didn’t care for I could just dump the rest and move on. Turned out the bottle last night met the savory flavors I was chasing to pair with dinner. Huh. With 12.6% ABV, I drank about 1/2 of it and tossed the remainder back into the fridge. Retasting tonight paired with lentil soup, the wine has filled out some more. Dried purple flower, black cherry, charcoal, olive, some chalky tannin that is mild to moderate in intensity, finishing with a savory, tarry, creosote-like note. This bottle is far better than the one from June and shows some decent structure to keep aging.
  • 2010 Copain Syrah Brosseau Vineyard - USA, California, Central Coast, Chalone (3/3/2018)
    Been about 3 years since I drank one of these. Hell, I still remember doing this from a decanter at the winery with Wells back in 2011. I’ve had many bottles since then but the one right now represents the biggest pause in between bottles so I was eager to open this last night and give it a spin. Last night it started off slowly, kind of dumb and I thought that the wine had seemingly aged too fast. However, it needed air to unfold the complexity. So, retasting today with a clean palate, the only wine in front of me. This is showing really well, with the Brosseau terroir of flowers, with a tangy, dark purple/raspberry fruit, crushed rocks, olive and lavender. It finishes with licorice and the savory quality of rosemary and garrigue. There is really no signs of fade in this vintage, even at 8 years out. The acidity remains lively, the primary qualities of the earlier years are now integrating and this is becoming really complex and savory, with plenty of chalk still lingering into the finish. Air well or let it age and continue to evolve.
  • 2010 Copain Syrah Brosseau Vineyard - USA, California, Central Coast, Chalone (5/16/2015)
    Copain Dinner With Wells Guthrie In The OC (The Loft @ Montage, Laguna Beach CA): Opened from mag in prep for dinner this evening, poured at room temp of 64f. Listed ABV is 13.0%. Eager to try this and get it some air too, as I know in its history it can be a beast from right bottle. Poured next to the 12 Baker Ranch, which is a different animal in color, as this Brosseau is several shades darker. This is indeed tight, with lots of red and blue fruit coiled up, along with charcoal and some rock. The blue fruit is laying underneath the structure, the acidity, for sure. The air this will need over the next 8 hours for dinner is going to be a big help.

Posted from CellarTracker

Hi All,

I saw this thread and had to taste for myself! So I went into the cave at the winery to pop these 2010s to see where they are at. TBH, as I get to know the Copain library (for those who don’t know, I took over for Wells Guthrie in early 2018. I blended and bottled the 2017s and 2018 onward are all my fault.) I am feeling that the sweet spot for the syrahs (in general) are 3-5 years with the best vintages maybe 5-7 years. Anything that improves further is a bonus.

So 10 years on with these two wines, you definitely have to be into aged qualities to score them higher

2010 Brosseau Vineyard Syrah (Chalone AVA) – Right upon opening: violet, anise and earth. Firm but, 1,000 grit tannins. After about 20 minutes, the wine remains to have a fresh, lively feel with some dead leaves and crushed rock. The primary fruit is certainly moved to the background, but the wine is by no means over the hill.

Is the window closing? Not necessarily. I think now for the next 2 years the wine will be pretty good. The thing about the style of this era of Copain syrahs (especially the wines from rocky terroirs like Yorkville Highlands) is that the structure holds up FOREVER.

The window of enjoyment will be different per individual based on your desire for the fruit/secondary flavor balance.

2010 Halcon Vineyard Syrah (Yorkville Highlands) – Upon opening leather, tamarind, iron with persistent tannin that is a touch rough. With air, the tannins smooth out. I find this wine to be quite charming and as it opens is all mint, pennyroyal and Spanish chorizo. My opinion is about the same with this wine as the Brosseau though I’d probably score it a few points higher.

Copain Wines, IMO show the best at the dinner table.

I encourage y’all to continue to follow our Syrah program as I grab the steering wheel. We have exciting things happening in the vineyards. Major steps to upgrade our farming. I am taking Wells’ vision and continuing to innovate it in the spirit of making better wines. Still going for brightness, moderate alcohols, etc. but always tweaking a bit to crack the code as any winemaker should.

We’ve now added Grenache to our Brosseau allocations and it is possible that some will make it into the Syrah blend. We are planting Grenache at High Rock as well. Very excited about our new estate Sonoma Coast Syrah from Annapolis that will be out soon.



Cheers,
Ryan Zepaltas
Winemaker // General Manager
Copain Wines
@ryanzepaltas

Mel – were you hearing Jackson Browne or some other version?
2010 was a tricky vintage. Almost as cool and rainy as 2011, it differed by two dramatic and short heat spikes – one in August and one on September 25th. I remember being at some pouring event outdoors in St Helena that day and thinking “man, it is HOT,” barbeque smoke wafting over, me wondering what it was like back on the coast. Sampled the funky old Martini clone Pinot that we were getting for rosé out at the Nobles vineyard (now goes to Schramsberg) the next day– Pick! We were sorting out the pinkish-greenish clusters for the first press load. Started monitoring the sugar level as it pressed and said “never mind” about said clusters as we were sorting the fruit for the second press load. While we bring in the rosé fruit at a lower brix, later on we really did see desiccation and underripeness at the same time, but that is what sorting is for. We made less wine in both of those years, less Peay, more Cep, but less wine overall by a long shot. I know certain folks were jazzed to have a “really cool” vintage, but honestly, it’s already really cool out here, and I was worried that the wines might just be simple. I have to say, I was wrong, our 2010’s are tasting great right now, but then maybe a little right in that they seem to be maturing on an earlier trajectory than the 09’s, ‘08’s, 07’s etc. But as for the Copain, you can imagine how a vintage like that could produce both a ripe impression and a simple wine at the same time. I wouldn’t write off the brand from that period as a whole. 2010 was a difficult vintage.
Annapolis! I was wondering what was happening to that 4 acres of clone 877 (a really good Syrah clone which I don’t have – ugh!) that was planted over there at the Ohlson Ranch. There used to be and may be still a La Crema Syrah, which, at one point back there in the mid-aughts was mostly Windsor fruit, but which is where I think the Ohlson Syrah went. I remember visiting with the vineyard foreman, Fermin, back in 2004, an early vintage. He was very proud of how nice the vines looked and I remember noting that their 8 x 5 spacing had two clusters for every shoot (!) I’ll have you know that that comes out to 4 to 5 tons per acre. Though a generally early vintage, it rained (heavily) on October 17th. They picked the next day. I do wonder what the blended La Crema wine tasted like…
Really looking forward to what you can do with that block, Ryan, a great melding of winemaking and resources!

I haven’t had the 2010 recently, but I did drink a 2011 Halcon just a few weeks ago:

2011 Copain Syrah Halcon Vineyard - USA, California, North Coast, Yorkville Highlands (4/23/2020)
Dark, not quite opaque garnet, no real signs of age, nose is subtle, with lightly herbal notes, the palate is where this gets interesting: beautiful medium depth, a melange of darker fruits, some blackberry, boysenberry, raspberry; plenty of well integrated acidity, with some fine slightly grippy tannins; lovely herbal spice notes intertwine the fruit, providing nice interest in this elegant, intricately complex Syrah. Still very youthful, with years of life and development ahead. This has the chance to be a true classic of California Syrah.

Later in the evening: even more lovely savory character coming through, pairing with the beautiful medium depth dark fruit, perfectly balanced acidity and structure, with plenty of reserve for the long term. A great Syrah. (94 pts.)

And since Nick chimed in here, I’ll give him some props with a 2007 I also drank recently:

2007 Peay Vineyards Syrah Les Titans - USA, California, Sonoma County, Sonoma Coast (5/5/2020)
Strong volcanic violet/Syrah nose, then dark, meaty, almost brooding deep blackberry fruit with streaks of boysenberry and pomegranate, excellent acidity, and fairly strong, slightly grippy tannins. Just classic Syrah, straddling old and new worlds. Cleaner than most northern Rhône’s, but just as complex and interesting. Gorgeous wine. (94 pts.)

A couple of wines that have both improved, and are nowhere near their peaks, at least IMO.

Thanks for the update, Ryan. I look forward to tasting and enjoying your workmanship in the future.

Nick

You are right that 2010 had a cold/late spring. The Halcon fruit was picked late October well after any heat spikes. Even though the vines were very young, I feel it was best fruit from our vineyard until 2016.

Paul