Does anyone understand how Domaine Wine Storage insures collections? They represent it is a Lloyds policy. Is it truely an independent policy that can be relied upon if something were to happen at Domaine? I have asked for details but have not received it yet. As others recommended on WB, I received a quote from Bluewater Insurance that came in reasonable enough. But I would not want to double pay for insurance if I do not have to.
Domaine’s policy covers up to $50k per client collection for anything that happens to your wines while stored there or in transit using their transport system. Though I don’t have the copy of the policy on hand, their website has some info:
Thank you. This reads pretty well, but is this what one can purely rely upon: “A Lloyd’s of London broker will issue a certificate of insurance including the client’s name as additionally insured.” I believe you can purchase more insurance (but I may be mistaken).
I have a separate policy due to renew soon that I’m debating on keeping, but that’s through AIG. Haven’t tried to buy more through Domaine.
My insurance through Chubb covers my offsite wine, so I have always turned down Domaine’s insurance. Note, though, that if you do, they take responsibility for nothing. If their driver breaks your wine while delivering it to you, they will not make good in any way. At least this was their policy when it happened to me.
Sarah- do you mean that one of Domaine’s delivery driver broke one of your bottles in transit and Domaine’s insurance didn’t cover it?
I did not realize you could turn down Domaine’s insurance. I recall being told me I could not do so when I signed up a few years ago, but maybe there was a minimum amount one needed to buy. Domaine’s rates are so cheap, but that makes me wonder whether its a truly independent policy you can rely upon.
To both questions:
Only because I had turned down their coverage, as I said. I haven’t looked at the contract for years, but at the time I was definitely able to turn down coverage. So when one of Domaine’s delivery drivers broke a bottle of mine and I asked if they would pay for it, they said no because I did not pay for their insurance coverage. I understand they are likely within their rights, but it seemed like poor customer relations to offer me nothing at all, not even an extra free delivery or something, when it was clearly their fault.
I’m missing something here. I also do not pay for Domaine coverage because of my Chubb policy. But why does your turning down coverage impact responsibility for their negligence providing a service other than storage? The loss here was not damage at their facility (i.e. power failure, flooding, etc.) but the negligence of their employee, no? Their liability coverage should cover the loss.
I’m not defending them, just relating what happened. It was my position as well, that their employee’s negligence was responsible for me loss; but they disagreed and would not offer me anything. After some arguing, the details of which I honestly don’t recall, I chose to leave it be, though I let them know I was not happy. It was probably 7 or 8 years ago and the only issue of note I have ever had with them.
As a strict rule, a collector should separately obtain insurance coverage with no affiliation whatsoever with a storage operator. Even a referral program should warrant concerns about either conflict of interest or, worse yet, adversely correlated claims-paying ability.
Extreme example, where the operator claimed to self-insure: Update: FEDERAL INDICTMENT - Safe Harbour Wine Storage and Bill Holder – CRIMINAL - WINE TALK - WineBerserkers
I’ve been trying to secure separate insurance that will cover my home-stored wines and Domaine-stored wines, but thus far unsuccessful. I’ve tried AIG and a local Chubb agent. AIG just seemed to say thanks but no thanks entirely, and Chubb said they’d only write it as a rider to a homeowners policy (which I want to keep with USAA). USAA won’t even add a rider to homeowners policy for wine stored in the house…
Any other ideas…
Which matters more to you, a great USAA rate or a great wine cellar? Which is harder to replace exactly?
Check bluewater
Understood and I would most likely do the same thing. I was just questioning the basis for their denial of liability.
This article discusses everything but the most important…the claims-paying ability of the insurer.
I just signed up with Blue Water FWIW. They know wine and will accept your Cellar Tracker spreadsheet for coverage. Easy process and seemed reasonable price for comprehensive coverage for multiple sites and in transit. I have storage at Domain but it made more sense to me to have separate coverage outside of them. Domain coverage read to me as catastrophic only and with unnecessary multi party risk as Victor highlighted. Thanks to those from this board that recommended them.
Bingo. That stipulation, while seeming to give comfort, is actually a severe coverage restriction and policyholder onus. So, who defines “catastrophic”, the insurer? Nice conflict of interest, to which the policyholder agrees. A non-catastrophic loss, like partial theft, might not be covered.
This is like buying a credit default swap, where the reference obligor does not default, but only widens in credit spread. The protection buyer pays the CDS running premium but gets scant risk mitigation (except for mark-to-market benefit), if the Credit Event is not triggered AND formally declared.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA…
Be sure to ask, and get an answer in writing, if a storage operator receives any compensation when a customer uses the affiliated insurer. Indeed, no matter what, a customer should get an insurance contract, enabling soundness checks with the state insurance regulator.