LATimes:ItalianVarietals In Calif

Or is it “Italian Varieties in Calif”??? Where’s the word police when I need them??
An interesting if shallow article by Verbilia in today’s LATimes on Italian Varieties/Varietals in Calif:
LATimes:ItalianVarietalsInCalif

It used to be that I’d go to the LATimes every Wed or Thurs to take a look at their Food section. They used to have some very good/informative articles by RussParsons & PatrickComiskey. Alas, it’s just a shadow of its former self. How the mighty have fallen.
Tom

And did you see this, Tom?
Nebbiolo: The next big thing in California wine?

Is Nebbiolo the next Pinot Noir?

Hmmm…don’t know if that’s a good or a bad thing.

It’s a bad thing. Let’s hope they don’t do to Nebbiolo, what they did to Pinot Noir.

Hmmmm…simply don’t understand this, Gary. Could you elaborate?
I think a Pinotish Nebbiolo would be a good thing. BrianHarrington’s is…light & bright & captures
the beautiful perfume of the variety. And I think a Nebbiolo made in the style of a Carlisle or a Colgin would also be a good thing.
In Calif, I’m not sure exactly what Nebbiolo is supposed to be, other than not Barolo/Barbaresco.
And curious who “they” is & what they actually did to Pinot in Calif.
Tom

Tom, David Arthur (right next door to Colgin) has some Nebbiolo planted. I didn’t try it when I was last time I was there, but that would give you the closest thing to a Colginish neb, at least terroirwise…

I find the articles exciting.

Great to see coverage of folks like Palmina in the LA area. I really like what Steve and Crystal are doing with that label, and it continues to bum me out that I can go into nicer Italian restaurants throughout our region - including in Santa Barbara County - and still not see their wines on lists.

Are they as ‘true to variety’ as many Italian wines? Subjective answers will abound, but I say they are worth the price and well worth the ‘education’ to see as a fine domestic example of the varieties they work with . . .

Cheers!

Palmina’s Nebbiolos are very varietal, in my opinion. Absolutely identifiable, and I enjoy them. I gave a Piedmontese enologist one of the earlier bottlings blind (the 2000, I think), and he was amazed.

Where’s the word police when I need them??

Right here Tom! And appalled, positively appalled, at the replacement of the plural with the singular!

“Where IS”? Surely you meant to write “Where ARE”

Anyhow, I’m completely on board with you, Larry, Oliver, etc. I think it’s fantastic that people aren’t locked into the idea that California should only produce Cab, Chardonnay, and Pinot Noir. Cripes, there are thousands of grape varieties. Plant them all and see what happens. California is larger than Italy and nobody has a problem with the fact that Italy has so many grape varieties all over the place. The only thing I’d ask of Nebbiolo from CA is that it not try to taste like it’s from Piedmont. And I’m certain that it can be equally as good, just different.

Given our latitude, it would make a lot of sense to try varieties from the south of Italy, too.

I think the whole Cal-Ital thing was set back 10 years or more by the failure of Sangiovese here, but there are so many other varieties.

That’s probably true and it’s also unfortunate.

Whatever happened to Pietra Santa? They were doing Italian grapes and some weren’t all that bad.

The key, I think, is to respect the variety. Research what sort of soil and climate it likes. Allow it to show itself in the winemaking with a delicate hand. A lot of early Pinot producers f’ed up because they had more of a Cab producer approach. I’ve tasted a lot of these obscure Italian and other varieties made here in CA that are picked so late and so brutalized that you can’t tell what they are. It doesn’t matter what they are. Why bother? On the other hand, a bunch of producers are doing an excellent job, which is very exciting.

I’ll also point out that some varieties have never found an ideal site for what they have to give in Europe. There they are considered secondary or obscure. With vast range of sites here, some perform better. The exploration is just beginning.

It does seem that the failure of Sangiovese here was due to winemakers trying, and failing, to mimic Italian versions. That said, I’ve had a few recent ones that were amazing. They didn’t resemble any I’ve had from Italy at all. (Though, I’d say varietally correct.)

Pietra Santa is still there. I’ve seen other labels that had wide distribution narrow it as the local customer base grew. Maybe that’s the case. Our area Whole Foods carries them, for example.

We’ve been making some Italian varieties at Harrington Wines the past couple of years - Nebbiolo (that one since '08), Fiano, Lagrein, and Teroldego. This year we’re adding a bunch of new ones - Sagrantino, Sangiovese, Marzemino, Montepulciano, and Aglianico. Tasted a few of the '13s last week that are already in barrel, and the Sagrantino and especially the Aglianico are very promising, and the Montepulciano was very good when we pressed it. Most likely some of these will be blended since we didn’t get too much of any of them this year - we’ll have to see how they turn out.

Nearly all of these were picked <24 brix, some of them <23, and none of them are in any new oak (the Fiano is made entirely in stainless). Tough to say whether these wines will bear a close resemblance to Italian wines from these varieties, but that’s not the goal. Just trying to see what these varieties can do in what seem to be some good vineyard locations in California.

If anyone thinks that you are going to make something and not be compared to the place that set the standard, well, I don’t know what to say to you. For the growers, winemakers, and owners I would ask, plead even, that you spend a decade or two intensely studying the grape/region before you launch into a project. Consumers need to have a full understanding of a grape/wine to judge it. And it is not really that subjective at all. All grapes/wines/places aren’t equal. Sorry. No one longs for a glass of Scuppernong on their deathbed. Just because you can plant/grow something somewhere doesn’t mean you should.

I guess I still don’t understand, Gary. I’ve not had a Calif Pinot that I would say compared to or was the quality
of a DRC. So therefore, Pinot is a failure in Calif?? I’ve not had an AltoPiemonte Nebbiolo or Valtelline Nebbiolo
that resembled much the gold standard of Barolo/Barbaresco. So those folks should give up on Nebbiolo??
I’m still interested in how Calif screwed up Pinot and who “they” are, if you could humor me. It’s not obvious
who you’re talking about.
Tom

I have learned that it is very difficult to talk about such things, without it turning into a mess. But I will say that so many producers in Cali, not all, just make a style of PN that is uninteresting. Warm ripe fruit, full of oak, very little acidity and lacking PN character. At least to me, that is what I find. But many people seem to enjoy it and it sells.

I don’t agree with the first of these assertions, and I’m not sure I understand the second, could you explain it further?

For example, if you have never tasted Barbera from Piedmont. And you tell me that you think California or Michigan makes great Barbera, I will probably disagree with you. After you taste a bunch of wines from Piedmont, read some info on the region and some writing from noted critics and wine writers, I would hope you have a better understanding of the grape/wine. And I would hope your opinion is different.

To the second point, learn the classics, then the exceptions.

Weird. Obviously, growers and winemakers should do a lot of research if they are attempting to do something great. But you seem to be asserting that consumers have no business enjoying a wine without extensive background study on how that grape performs elsewhere. Why can’t a consumer stumble across a CA Barbera that works for him in a way most CA Cab, Pinot, Merlot doesn’t? Why would he need to know what Italian Barberas taste like to know if he enjoys the wine he’s drinking or not?

Wouldn’t the whole point, when aiming for excellence, in growing a specific variety at a specific site here in CA for it to perform differently, to be distinctive? If you just try to mimic a classic wine from elsewhere, aren’t you resigning yourself to making a second-rate copy?

You say many, not all, CA producers make uninteresting PN. So? I can’t disagree, but with so many wineries (3400?) here, more than enough are making excellent PN to keep me happy. Also, aside from the excess oak, the reasons those PNs aren’t interesting to you (or me) suggests that PN is the wrong grape for those sites and/or it’s the wrong grape to achieve what the winemaker really likes. Maybe ignorance. Maybe marketing reality. I’ve had Napa Cab producers confide that they don’t like the varietal characteristics of Cab as an explanation for the high ripeness level they pick at. They could make a better Syrah, one they liked better, from the same site, but they’d be lucky to fetch half the price for it.

Anyway, unless you’re arguing that people shouldn’t bother trying to make good wine in California, I would think you’d agree that much of the climate (and soils) are actually more suitable to Italian and other Mediterranean grapes than French and German ones.

I guess that’s one way to look at it, Gary. But what if I declare MattRorick’s GreenHungarian the greatest GreenHungarian I’ve ever had, on what basis would
you disagree with that?? Not raggin’ on you or anything…just having a hard time understanding your viewpoint.
Tom