I’m trying to get smart on the aging qualities of French Burgundy vs. Pinot Noir from other regions, like California. I read all the time that burgundy starts fresh, then closes into a “dumb” phase, and then many years later, voila!, you have your world-famous burgundy.
I drink a fair amount of Cali and Oregon Pinot, but it seems to me that a lot of board drinkers consume these wines young, say within 10 years. Is that because these wines don’t “behave” the same way as burgundy? Or because these producers are relatively new, at least compared to burgundy?
I think vineyard is key in France. The best are not only pricey but have “pedigree” to a level that is beyond a single human-life’s comprehension. The hierarchy in Burgundy is very different than Bordeaux based not just on geography but micro-climates (climats, lieux-dit, etc) and slightly less mercantilism due in part to the monastic heritage of the region.
With that said, there are long running track records of the “great” vineyards. These are ones that have performed for centuries and have designations such as Grand Cru or 1er Cru. However, with all things historical, there is forgetting and of course preference that play a role. While, the moniker in Burgundy is “Producer, Producer, Producer,” this is a slight fallacy. Terroir and vineyard are the hallmark that these producers want to reach. Some get it, others don’t while outsiders covet its allure.
At the end of the day, Burgundy is like any other agricultural land. There are great Burgundies that drink in the same span as you are describing for OR and CA. Places like Fixin, Marsannay, Cote Chalonnaise and even Beaune wines offer value and “quicker” cellar times. But of course there are outliers, as there are outliers in the exalted regions that have been downgraded or praised for fame not taste. Whether they changed the top soil and lost AOC or own a monopole that always demands buyers; it is all to be held within a glass meant for your enjoyment.
As for its direct relation to OR/CA, it is a cooler climate and place known to grow grapes well particularly the finicky PN. The soil is limestone (calcaire) afflicted and poor minus the topsoil. I think at the end of the day, Burgundy has an “intellectual” component that exults its status coupled with its actual rarity compared to larger, higher producing regions that creates its mystique. Not to mention the absurdity of the French inheritance and retirement laws that loom over the region.
I have several Arcadian wines like Sleepy Hollow that age well past 10 years and are phenomenal. I would say that most/many CA Pinot will age gracefully to 10 years but getting to 20 we’ll only see a few producers wines. I’m no expert on OR pinot but from the TN I read numerous age very well out to 20 and beyond. I’ll defer to the experts on OR.
I’m guilty of drinking my CA pinot too early; last year I packed away a large representation of most of my CA pinot at my off site storage to keep me from robbing the cradle. I might pull a few every couple of years to see “where they are”.
Great question Scott; I’m sure we’ll see some great feedback on the age worthiness of CA / OR Pinot Noir.
I had a 1999 Rochioli PN this year that was amazing , last year i had a Mount Eden PN from the 80’s that was awesome…also check the David Bruce thread by Tom Hill…great old Pinots
Certainly some West Coast pinots can age. Some of the bigger, riper ones I would have doubts about, since their acidities can be low, and acidity is crucial to long-term aging.
Another aspect to your question is whether the wines gain more complexity with age. Many California cabs, for instance, soften after a few years and then plateau for long, long periods without a lot of further evolution.
The remarkable thing about great Burgundy (and there is lots of mediocre Burgundy) is that can seem thin and tart when young yet can age for decades and become fruitier and silky and very complex. I’ve never known a New World pinot to manage that feat.
I’ve had a few Selyem pinots that are 10+ years old. The 1997 Riverblock vineyard was pretty fantastic. The few 2001 Russian river valley pinots were also quite nice, if not as complex. I have two 1990 Olivet Lane Selyem Pinots as well. We’ll see how those turn out.
The older single vineyard Selyem pinots were definitely as complex as any of the nice GC burgs I’ve had. Maybe not as good as the super GCs, but I’ve never had DRC, Leroy etc. The alcohol on the older Selyems was about 14%, so I would think the newer ones will age much the same.
I’ve certainly had a number of California and Oregon pinots at app. 12-15 years which seemed to be peaking with no fear of imminent decline. This is from producers like St. Innocent, Arcadian, Domaine Drouhin, older (pre-1998) Williams Selyem and Mt. Eden. None of them seemed like they needed to go to 20 years as grand cru Burgs from vintages like 1993 required but it’s possible they would have continued to improve if I had tried them later. But I was very happy drinking them at age 15.
And the 2004 Rhys Home at age 9 was delicious and seemed to be just starting to hit its stride.
To me the difference is that with Burgundy it is a must to age. With new world PN it is an option. Maybe with certain producers, like many mentioned here, it is a strongly recommended option. But still an option.
I think that the need to age Burgundy has been well established in the minds of wine lovers for eons, while many are still trying to get a handle on California Pinot Noir. My experience with some of the better CA Pinots (Rochioli, Copain and Rhys for three) is that they are equally demanding of age to show their best.
But Markus has hit on a sore spot for me - the pretense that Burgundy is somehow seperate and apart from Pinot Noir. Burgundy is the oldest, most established and storied location for Pinot Noir. And it is Pinot Noir.
It is? I thought it was made from the Burgundy grape. Next you will be telling me that there is no grape named Gevrey Chambertin. There has to because it see the name all the time.
Rick beat me to it, but I have a case of 2001 Arcadian Sleepy Hollow and man is it fantastic. My plan is save at a few bottles until the the end of time essentially, just to see what happens with them.
![[scratch.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/4/42a16863a8714da3c1604419e3eb9206bb87aa50.gif "scratch"){kind=small}
