central coast GSM vs. Rhone

Newbie question.

I had a Chateauneuf du pape. Loved it.

Through my research, I discovered that a lot of Rhone style wines are made in the Central Coast of CA.

I know there are tons of variables, but how do California Rhone style wines compare of French Rhone style wines?

Is it logical to think “Oh, i like Rhone style wines so I will get them from California, not France?”

This is a good question. I would suggest moving it to the “Wine Talk” forum. It will get more eyeballs and comments.

This is just my take. My wife and I went to CdP last year and did a lot of tasting and buying. Since then we’ve done a good bit of drinking. We also bought the Halcon Vineyards offering during the quarantine relief period on WB. The Halcon wine was very very good and for $30-$40 a bottle is a great deal. I’d say it competes well with most CdP wines. The top CdP wine night be better but would also be 3x the cost. My opinion is that we will be buying more Halcon wine in the future.

I second this recommendation. There’s a huge thread on Rhone Syrah’s that’s very informative.

In general… very general, Central California GSM’s tend to have higher alcohol contents, more approachable early on. They cannot match the complexity, earthiness or elegance of Northern Rhone’s or CdP’s from France. That said, central coast winemakers are newbies compared to old world GSM producers, who’ve been plying their trade for hundreds of years.

Look into Tablas Creek.

They were started by a CdP and an importer. I haven’t had much experience with Rhone but I enjoy TC

I’ve been a wine club member of Tablas Creek for many years.

I find California wines to be very good and approachable early on - this is true for Cabernet-Sauvignons, Chardonnays, and Merlot. GSM as well. West coast wines are more fruit-forward in general than comparable French ones given the hotter weather. However, the best California wine would rarely match excellent producers from France. And I am not only talking about Grand Crus here. The complexity of the terroir and the subtleties of the wine-makings are simple on another level in places like France, Italy, and even Germany compared to the US. Saying otherwise: I would happily spend $200 for a red Bordeaux; I would likely never spend $200 for a Napa Cab-Sauv.

Not the Central Coast, but Terre Rouge makes all sorts of Rhone varietals up in the Sierra Foothills, and they are excellent. Highly recommended.

In general, I would say their approach is clearly closer to the Rhone style than, say, Napa is to Bordeaux.

But still a bit more fruit forward, still a bit riper/bigger, and even their Syrahs creep up to 14.5% ABV. They can still age for >20 years (Their '98 Sentinel Oak Syrah is fantastic, very much alive, and only $65!), but they drink well when young too.

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Lots to choose from - but saying ‘Central Coast’ is kind of like saying ‘North Coast’ and saying that Napa, Sonoma and Lake Counties are ‘all the same’ . . .

Lots of great suggestions - many of the wines in the Paso and SB area tend to be on the ‘riper’ side - as are many CdP wines these days as well.

Perhaps you can narrow down exactly what you like about CdP or Rhone wines and then we can go from there. Plenty more to choose from if you are looking at the riper side of things - if you’re looking for more delicate or perhaps earth-driven wines, it’ll be a bit more of a challenge . . .

Cheers!

Add me to the Tablas Creek fan club as well. I haven’t tried their one-off offerings, but their main Cote d’Tablas and Esprit d’Tablas blancs and rouge as very Beaucastel-styled for good reason.

I’m still working my way through Larry’s sampler but the two whites (sorry at work and can’t remember which ones specifically) we had were dead ringers for white southern Rhones.

Anthony,

Thank you - and my 2014 Verbiage Rouge is definitely an ‘old world’ CdP style blend . . .

Cheers!

I will be a bit of a counterpoint here. Most CdP are similarly priced to California GSM, with the exceptions being at the higher end. The general fruitiness/ripeness, gloss and higher alcohol of Cali GSM I find offputting.

I am even moreso unimpressed with California Syrah, which rarely gives me the depth, ferality, tension and smokiness/meatiness of Northern Rhone. I hate the high alcohol. I have had many excellent California Syrahs and many high rated ones, but nothing has come close. I am just one palate.

I will admit that Halcon makes -really good- wines, and they come close to Northern Rhone. Have had some good, some bad from Tablas Creek, with older wines not holding up very well.

Honestly, Larry, at the end of the day I don’t think consumers at large pay much attention to wineries being categorized as from the ‘Central Coast’. It is up to them to educate their customers on the uniqueness of what they make and keep that front and center. I understand your point but keep in mind that a lot of people travel to your region because of a 17-year-old buddy movie. My North Coast volume contains Sonoma, Lake, and some Napa but I haven’t heard any complaints. You give too much credit to the attention span of consumers.