Man, I am trying to recall the specifics. I was only there once, 12-18 months ago - it was a Delmonico, it was med-rare, I think it was 12 ounces. I thought we were able to choose the aging length, but maybe I am wrong? It had a great smoky/nuttiness to it. From some of the comments in this thread, maybe I got lucky. It was great. The guy I was with doesn’t drink wine (bastard!) so I drank off their by the glass list, but it paired well with a 1975 Inglenook Cabernet. It was awesome you could get such an old wine by the glass.
1975 Inglenook Cabernet by the glass. FTW.
I think those who live in NY (and Vegas and Chicago) have access to some of the great steak houses in the world, and Bern’s is nowhere close to that. My one experience at Berns was not terrible, but certainly suffered compared to the better ones like Peter Luger, Sparks, Ben Benson, Post House, and even Smith and Wollensky.
Interestingly, when I was in London, I was invited to Hawksmoor near Picadilly, which is considered the best in London, and that too was second rate going on third compared to the NY houses.
I know! I am not much of a cab guy, but I am learning I just don’t like young cabs. That was delicious.
I’ve been eating at Hawksmoor for 5-6 years (haven’t been to the newest on Air St, which is the one you reference). Hawksmoor serves pasture raised, grass-fed English Longhorn beef. I prefer grass-fed beef to feed lot beef for a number of reasons and the steaks at Hawksmoor, especially the blackboard steaks, are uniformly better in my opinion than any grass-fed steak I’ve eaten in an US restaurant.
I have been to the Hawksmoor a number of times and it’s very good. But in comparison I prefer Goodman. Their beef seems to offer a bit more particularity than what’s on offer at Hawksmoor. If you live in London and want to take a short trip to eat good beef, there is a restaurant in Brussels called La Paix. It’s in the Anderlecht neighborood, and it gives the appearance of a simple brasserie, But there are two things that set it apart. First, the chef cooked at Arpege and Bruneau so the starters are at one to two star quality. Second is, they always have three or four different types of beef on offer and on any given day they can be offering Simmenthal, Charolais, beef sourced from the Netherlands and the rarely seen outside of Spain, Rubio Gallega. I was there twice in the past year and had great meals, both times accompanied by tasty bottles of Jean Foillard Cote de Py. Thing is they are only open for lunch on Monday-Friday, and dinner on Friday. Cool place with delicious food and all of the foodies in the know in Brussels go there.
1975 Inglenook must have been great. And I am not a cab drinker.
I was only at Bern’s once. My impression was as follows. Their menu goes through this entire rigomarole about how you should order a thinly cut steak and not a thick one. It goes on to say how thinly cut is better blah, blah, blah. Well I think that’s a bunch of bunk and even though I have no knowledge as to whether what I am going to say is true or not, the experience made me wonder if they do the following. You see prime beef, that of the grade used at places like Luger’s or Bern’s, is in short supply and hard to come by, and by pushing thinner steaks their inventory lasts longer. I also think that’s why the Bern’s menu is loaded up with so many large starters. I found I was half full before the steak even arrived at my table. Thing is, if you ask them to cut you a think steak and cook it with a char crust, they will be happy to do it and I believe you will have a better experience.
Different steakhouses deal with prime beef shortages differently. Luger’s doesn’t cut their steaks any thinner, but they don’t seem to age them as long. Some times when I go to Luger’s, the steaks taste like they are really aged. And sometimes they taste like they were cut off the cow that morning. My hunch is that it depends on whether they have enough inventory on hand to let the aging process extend for 28 days.
Can you show where they say that? Their menu doesn’t seem to say it at all, in fact they recommend thick steaks in several instances. If you read the chart, it’s clear that they don’t like thick steaks for more doneness but for rare and medium rare they seem pretty happy with them.
Details.
Craig-correct as far as everything I have read. Also agree with others that steak was underwhelming during my recent visit. I beat that up in its own thread, so I will sign off.
Is this a test?
I don’t have their physical menu in front of me (it would be weird if I did wouldn’t it) but I remember how odd it was reading that chart. But I also remember our waiter giving us this entire spiel on how they recommend thinly cut steaks.
Have you ever seen that done at another steakhouse? It was a first for me. In fact I can’t think of a single reason for doing that because one could argue that steaks have an optimum thickness. And one would think that if you want your customers to have the best experience possible, you would cut the steaks at what you think is the perfect thickness. After all, cooking steak is a simple process which is governed by the ratio of the thickness of the meat, the level of heat, and the distance the exterior is from the heat. And in a system where the thickness changes from order to order, I can’t imagine that the Bern’s people do not believe it has an impact on the end result. In fact in my experience, many steakhouses are challenged when people at the same table order different levels of doneness. Throwing the thickness factor into the mix (like a 3-dimensional chess match) almost makes it impossible to turn out the perfect steak.
My hunch is that the chart is part of the marketing gimmick. The carnival barker shows you a gold watch that’s worth X, and then after wetting your appetite, he gives you a spiel that says a less expensive watch is actually preferable. If you think of it, it defies business logic because what businessmen would prefer to make a sale for less money than he could? But most people fall for their spiel, including me, because they want to feel like they are getting a bargain. And while I enjoyed my steak, I did feel as if I had been had a bit.
Guess it is a test…
“A thick steak for two is always better than two single steaks - when broiled rare or medium rare. Individual steaks are better for medium well or well done. A thick steak gives you much greater charcoal flavor. And there’s nothing quite like a beautiful, dark brown charcoal crust over a juicy red or pink center. Chances are, you will enjoy half of a 16 oz. steak for two much more than you will enjoy an individual 8 oz. steak. Except if you prefer your steak medium well or well done. In that case, order thin steaks. You’ll have much less shrinkage.”
http://www.bernssteakhouse.com/Our-Steaks/Notes-About-Our-Steaks
Reading this thread is one of the few things i dislike about this board…a person who has never posted here has come here to offer an opinion (who by all standards of everything i have read about him, clearly has some experience in fine dining and isn’t just some guy pointing out stuff) and immediately several members of this board strongly disagree with him (which is fine), but then attempt to bully him (which in my opinion is not fine). It has long been my impression that this board was full of more reasonable people who truly love wine and food and are on it to engage in discourse about the previously mentioned subjects. I find myself hesitating to post form time to time so that I don’t incur the wrath of the 3-5 or so folks on here who seem to take the view that their opinion, and only their opinion is the right one. Different strokes for different folks, and as much as we accept that people like different types of wines, we ought to accept that different people have different takes on other matters as well.
Tex have you been to Bern’s
AWilliamson - I once wrote a blog post on exactly the phenomenon you describe. It’s about people who try to score points in these types of discussions that don’t have first hand experience with the topic they are debating. Why people do that (and I have been known to do it on occasion) could be a thread of its own. But you are correct when you say that it is one of the worst things about Internet chat rooms, and it played a large role in why I shut mine down and don’t participate much anymore. Anyway you can read it for yourself
You of course can have you opinion, but I don’t see any bullying.
Steve has a history from the Squires Board, so that is probably carrying over here. The late Bob Wood could expound on this in much greater detail than I.
FTR, I have never been to Bern’s.
Joe - we went to Bern’s 1-2X/year in the 90s; and while it was Burg & Bord heaven back then these trips also stamped my love of aged Ridge. These are my memories, I doubt we even glanced at a menu. Waiters knew to bring us a group steak, Chateaubriand or such, and the only argument was rare vs Pittsburgh-rare. Haven’t been in a decade or longer, the place was always about the wine but the food was never an issue.
My understanding is Mons Venus isn’t what it once was either. damn shame.
I’m not sure if my post was being implicated as “bullying” but if so I would invite anyone to go back and read it.
I have been to Bern’s twice. I have read the menu recently. I have an old copy of the wine list. I fully enjoyed my visits including the steaks. However I won’t claim to be any expert on steak and I can’t compare to any of the other places mentioned.
The point I was making is this: Steve said things about their menu (not what the waiter said - that part came in a later post) that don’t seem correct, and used that info to support a suggested motive on Bern’s part to manage supply of meat, which I think is just weird. It seems completely inconsistent with stocking a giant wine cellar and selling old wines at low prices. All the info on the menu (which is online) sounds to me like they are trying to help you order the steak you will enjoy the most, and that is the way I remember it. Sometimes there is no conspiracy.
I agree that we should not bully and pile on to people but if you offer strong opinions based on sketchy data you have to expect someone to challenge them.
Don’t know if anyone has been to Jean George at the Aria in Las Vegas recently, but I ate there Monday and was wowed by their Tomahawk Rib-eye. Best steak I’ve had in quite some time, although a bit pricey.
The things I said about their menu, and their marketing practices, were conclusions I came to on my own. If you read my posts, I think I was clear on that. But realize that I have found that most commercial practices in restaurants that do not make any sense are purely because they have calculated that the policy will make them more money . That’s based on my experience as a diner who eats out a few hundred times a year if not more. I have yet to find a restaurant that has an unusual policy, whether it be no reservations, no BYO, no taking photos etc. where the silly rule or suggestion they make isn’t based on a calculation that the policy will make them more money. Take Peter Luger’s no-BYO policy. It was instituted to make sure people don’t linger at their tables so they can turn them over at a quicker pace. Luger’s can actually turn over a table four times a night. But allow a bunch of wine geeks to BYO, and that table might be turned over two and a 1/2 times on average.
Everything happens for a reason and when you are talking about restaurants that churn people through their doors like cattle, 99% of the time it’s about money. Take the recent phenomenon of restaurants refusing to make alterations to dishes for diners with allergies or special diets. Do you think that is about the art of making the perfect cheeseburger or the owner has calculated that special orders cost him too much money because deviating from the norm increases the chances of a screw up?
Can you provide a reference to this? Maybe they should hire competent staff members that can handle special requests.