Explain Like I’m Five: The Method to Your Madness in Standing Wines Up Before Consuming

[John_A_Hunt]

old wine is like muddy water—dirt in water. Stand the bottle up and the dirt goes to the bottom. Carefully pour off the clean wine.

I’m all in for whatever ritual helps you enjoy a bottle of wine.

The New Jersey in me is skeptical that anything suspended in the liquid would not have settled by standing overnight. Weeks of standing seem more for effect than results.

I don’t have a lot of old bottles full of sediment, but I had a snow-globe as a kid. Thanks for reminding me Alan, I think I had a bucket with muddy water, too. Yes, it’s not the same thing, but the dynamic is.

[alan_weinberg]

old wine is like muddy water—dirt in water. Stand the bottle up and the dirt goes to the bottom. Carefully pour off the clean wine.

I’m all in for whatever ritual helps you enjoy a bottle of wine.

The New Jersey in me is skeptical that anything suspended in the liquid would not have settled by standing overnight. Weeks of standing seem more for effect than results.

I don’t have a lot of old bottles full of sediment, but I had a snow-globe as a kid. Thanks for reminding me Alan, I think I had a bucket with muddy water, too. Yes, it’s not the same thing, but the dynamic is.

if the bottle is all shaken up, sediment won’t settle quickly. Burgundy has fine sediment and it can take weeks. If a bottle has been on its side a long time, all of the sediment on the down side, and you carefully lift it to horizontal, sediment slides down and you can pour a clean bottle with careful decantation.

[Frank_Drew]

Been using a wire mesh filter to catch larger pieces of sediment on pours of older reds. When I get to the bottom 1/3-1/4 of the bottle I am using the unbleached coffee filters. This worked well for an 84’ Spottswoode I had two weeks ago.

Jeff, I use a very simple, double ultra-fine filter setup for most red wines now and am very happy with the results — great clarity of the wine but no loss of aroma or flavor.

[Ron_Slye]

Been using a wire mesh filter to catch larger pieces of sediment on pours of older reds. When I get to the bottom 1/3-1/4 of the bottle I am using the unbleached coffee filters. This worked well for an 84’ Spottswoode I had two weeks ago.

Jeff, I use a very simple, double ultra-fine filter setup for most red wines now and am very happy with the results — great clarity of the wine but no loss of aroma or flavor.

Is it easy to buy or did you have to construct it.

[Stephen_Faulkner]

old wine is like muddy water—dirt in water. Stand the bottle up and the dirt goes to the bottom. Carefully pour off the clean wine.

I’m all in for whatever ritual helps you enjoy a bottle of wine.

The New Jersey in me is skeptical that anything suspended in the liquid would not have settled by standing overnight. Weeks of standing seem more for effect than results.

I don’t have a lot of old bottles full of sediment, but I had a snow-globe as a kid. Thanks for reminding me Alan, I think I had a bucket with muddy water, too. Yes, it’s not the same thing, but the dynamic is.

I’ll avoid any NJ jokes, but for you and any other skeptics, it is simple physics that the time it takes the particles to settle out depends on the density of both the particles and the the liquid they are in. If everything is the same large size, then yes it will settle overnight, but that is not relevant to most red wines we are interested in decanting.

[DougS]

Anyone who is skeptical hasn’t experimented with overnight vs a few days vs a few weeks. Super-fine sediment sticks together over longer periods of time, allowing for clear wine rather than slightly cloudy, and there is definitely a difference in taste.

I prefer to rest wines at an angle, something close to 45 degrees. The longer the better for leaving as little wine as possible in the bottle and having totally clear wine in the decanter. If the wines are cellared at home, I think the basket technique is probably the absolute best (why move the sediment at all after years of it resting in the same place?).

[Tom_G_l_a_s_g_o_w]

Does anyone have a good cradle recommendation? I frequent decant younger wines for sediment.

[John_Morris]

… it is simple physics that the time it takes the particles to settle out depends on the density of both the particles and the the liquid they are in. If everything is the same large size, then yes it will settle overnight, but that is not relevant to most red wines we are interested in decanting.

Anyone who is skeptical hasn’t experimented with overnight vs a few days vs a few weeks. Super-fine sediment sticks together over longer periods of time, allowing for clear wine rather than slightly cloudy, and there is definitely a difference in taste.

+1 to both comments. And that’s why the grape is also relevant.

As Michael H and Alan W have said (respectively), nebbiolo and red Burgundy throw particularly fine sediment that is slow to settle out. And if it is still suspended, it can detract terribly from the wine. I curse every time someone in NYC brings an undecanted older Burgundy on the subway to a dinner or tasting. So many spoiled bottles, even after an hour or so of resting time! (Yes, I have some idiot friends with good cellars.)

I find that syrah and, particularly, cabernet sediment is less problematic. It settles faster and doesn’t mess up the wine as badly if you get some in your glass.

[Keith_Levenberg]

So….explain like I’m five how you approach this topic please.

Well, since you asked…

[Jim_Erwin]

Does anyone have a good cradle recommendation? I frequent decant younger wines for sediment.

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[Arv_R]

You can look at these pictures I took last night to see the difference in color/clarity/sediment between a glass poured from the ‘top’ of a bottle, vs. from the bottom. This bottle was 30 years old, and had been standing up for a couple of weeks. Look at pix 3 and 4 which are top & bottom, respectively.

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[Todd_Hamina]

old wine is like muddy water—dirt in water. Stand the bottle up and the dirt goes to the bottom. Carefully pour off the clean wine.

+1, a double decant is the best way to miss out on the beautiful and delicate components of older wines.

[Andrew_K]

I’ve tried both ways. I haven’t found standing it up for a while to be any better and it certainly is more hassle. As others have said, most of the sediment is stuck to the side of the bottle anyway. So I just remove it from my cellar carefully, keep it on its side, carefully open and decant. Done that recently with some bottles from the 60s and 70s and they’ve come out perfectly clear. If I have a special bottle that I’m planning for an event, I might bother to stand it up.

[CFu]

old wine is like muddy water—dirt in water. Stand the bottle up and the dirt goes to the bottom. Carefully pour off the clean wine.

+1, a double decant is the best way to miss out on the beautiful and delicate components of older wines.

i disagree. I think older wine actually needs air to shine. If it’s a well stored wine of high quality, air won’t hurt it.

All anyone needs is a trip to Berns where they decant pretty much everything

[lleichtman]

10+ years i’ll stand em up if they are reds. I’ve become accustomed to standing up wines a week or two ahead for reds and then double decant at my storage facility.

You could also just bring them out from the side and carefully put them in a wine basket as well to serve/double decant. But that’s just one extra bit of potential for jostling the bottle.

I’ve become super anal about this. One of our groups - everyone stands up and double decants before dinner (since it’s mostly older burgundy), but it’s not uniform. I thought a 99 bachelet charmes and 96 leroy beauxmont this past week were sub optimal cause they got shaken up like crazy while people were pouring and moving bottles around where the bottom half of the bottle was not enjoyable.

Well. I stand up all reds older than 10 years, though most of mine are that already, for a week before decanting. I hate seeing sediment come out and have never been great with the flashlight technique.

[John_Morris]

I’ve tried both ways. I haven’t found standing it up for a while to be any better and it certainly is more hassle. As others have said, most of the sediment is stuck to the side of the bottle anyway. So I just remove it from my cellar carefully, keep it on its side, carefully open and decant. Done that recently with some bottles from the 60s and 70s and they’ve come out perfectly clear. If I have a special bottle that I’m planning for an event, I might bother to stand it up.

What types of wine are you talking about? Syrah is the only type of unfortified type I can think of where the sediment routinely crusts on the side of the bottle. Maybe a bit with cabernet-based wines, maybe some Ribero del Duero that haven’t spend many years in cask. But not pinot or nebbiolo or others I can think of.

I think we’re talking past each other unless we specify what kinds of wines we’re opining about.

[Todd_Hamina]

old wine is like muddy water—dirt in water. Stand the bottle up and the dirt goes to the bottom. Carefully pour off the clean wine.

+1, a double decant is the best way to miss out on the beautiful and delicate components of older wines.

i disagree. I think older wine actually needs air to shine. If it’s a well stored wine of high quality, air won’t hurt it.

All anyone needs is a trip to Berns where they decant pretty much everything

I guess if getting the beautiful old wine consumed quickly is your goal, then I agree with you.

Disclaimer: Bern’s and Haven are customers.

[Tom_G_l_a_s_g_o_w]

+1, a double decant is the best way to miss out on the beautiful and delicate components of older wines.

i disagree. I think older wine actually needs air to shine. If it’s a well stored wine of high quality, air won’t hurt it.

All anyone needs is a trip to Berns where they decant pretty much everything

I guess if getting the beautiful old wine consumed quickly is your goal, then I agree with you.

Disclaimer: Bern’s and Haven are customers.

You’re suggesting it’s better to spend a few hours following the wines development?

[Nick_Christie]

I disagree. I think older wine actually needs air to shine. If it’s a well stored wine of high quality, air won’t hurt it.

All anyone needs is a trip to Berns where they decant pretty much everything

#TeamInfluencer on this age-old thread question.

[CFu]

+1, a double decant is the best way to miss out on the beautiful and delicate components of older wines.

i disagree. I think older wine actually needs air to shine. If it’s a well stored wine of high quality, air won’t hurt it.

All anyone needs is a trip to Berns where they decant pretty much everything

I guess if getting the beautiful old wine consumed quickly is your goal, then I agree with you.

Disclaimer: Bern’s and Haven are customers.

once again disagree. Well stored old wines need time to stretch. Similar to the grandpa in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. If you have a frail old wine - sure you don’t want to decant it. But when you have a well stored wine of pedigree, a decant for sediment doesn’t hurt it

Not sure when was the last time I had a well stored older bottle of burgundy/cab, that was decanted for sediment, and thought to myself “gosh i wish i didn’t decant this cause it fell apart”. It’s usually 2-3 hours in and we’re wishing we gave it even more air.

Our burgundy group (which Dr. Weinberg is in and he double decants his wine for sediment for dinner) - everyone double decants the wines for sediment to bring to dinner. We are usually drinking 20-30+ year old red burgundy. Don’t even get me started on old California Cabernet, I could double decant those 70s Heitz/Mayacamas/Diamond Creek/Ridge and drink over 2-3 hours and still not feel like i’m hitting the apex as they keep getting better