If you could go back in time and collect one German riesling consistently over the years...?

[Nate_M]

Back in the day, it was not easy to find dry German wines systematically at retail in the US.

Where do you find this now? Which retailer?

Thanks!

[Jayson_Cohen]

Back in the day, it was not easy to find dry German wines systematically at retail in the US.

Where do you find this now? Which retailer?

Thanks!

Sticking with the NY area, people like Robert Dentice (I’m guessing he will chime in here), Stephen Bitterolf, Collin Wagner (who works with Stephen at Von Boden), Clara Dalzell (Flatiron German buyer), John McIlleheny (Chambers German buyer), and others are the ones for this question. But in New York City plenty of retailers sell dry German wines now.

[Jim_Hanlon]

I don’t want to hijack this thread, and if you all want I can start a new thread, but I have different question pertaining to this question (for the same audience).

Where do you find yourself buying the majority of your Riesling?

I am really looking for a wine shop that has Riesling diversity.

Vinopolis in Portland is a good source.

[Jim_Stewart]

. . .
WsOTY:
Felettig Morey St. Denis VV '14
Felettig Chamb-Mus VV '14
Pépière Muscadet Briords '09
Volpaia Chianti Class '18
Lignier Morey St Denis 1er Ormes '14
Collestefano Verdicchio di M '19
Pépière Muscadet Briords '19
Bêcheur PN '14
Virage '07
Ampeau Volnay 1er Santenots '99

I see that you liked the '19 Briords, Peter. Please tell us more . . . TN?

[alan_weinberg]

Donnhoff Eiswein. The few I’ve had were spectacular.

[Tom_Reddick]

For off-dry and sweet, I’m with David. I would have loaded up on Schwarz-era Muller-Catoir sweet and halbtrocken so that I wouldn’t have reached today’s state of affairs. I’m down to very few bottles. I would have focused on 1988-1990, 1993s to 1998s, and 2001. That’s a call that is really hindsight because I bought and drank so many in the moment and over the years until supply became scarce, and it’s not enough. (An aside, but this would have included buying more Scheurebe as well.) We could start listing vineyards but if forced to chose one, it’s probably Haardter Burgergarten.

If you keep watch on the various internet auctions (Winebid, Acker, Zachy’s etc.), those old Muller-Catoirs come up on occasion and most are still drinking beautifully. I have opened a few 89-92 era wines in the past couple of years that were very inexpensive (aside from the case of 92 TBA- but even that was a relative steal) and are absolutely magnificent now.

But I still share your wish- I drank too many of those wines young, and the occasional auction appearance gives me just enough to open them sparingly. I wish I had more today- especially the hauntingly good 1998s.

However the one thing I really wish I had bought from day 1 because they are practically impossible to find now is Emrich-Schonleber’s Auf der Lay. Magnums only, and at the auctions. 2008 was the first vintage.

[Jayson_Cohen]

For off-dry and sweet, I’m with David. I would have loaded up on Schwarz-era Muller-Catoir sweet and halbtrocken so that I wouldn’t have reached today’s state of affairs. I’m down to very few bottles. I would have focused on 1988-1990, 1993s to 1998s, and 2001. That’s a call that is really hindsight because I bought and drank so many in the moment and over the years until supply became scarce, and it’s not enough. (An aside, but this would have included buying more Scheurebe as well.) We could start listing vineyards but if forced to chose one, it’s probably Haardter Burgergarten.

If you keep watch on the various internet auctions (Winebid, Acker, Zachy’s etc.), those old Muller-Catoirs come up on occasion and most are still drinking beautifully. I have opened a few 89-92 era wines in the past couple of years that were very inexpensive (aside from the case of 92 TBA- but even that was a relative steal) and are absolutely magnificent now.

But I still share your wish- I drank too many of those wines young, and the occasional auction appearance gives me just enough to open them sparingly. I wish I had more today- especially the hauntingly good 1998s.

However the one thing I really wish I had bought from day 1 because they are practically impossible to find now is Emrich-Schonleber’s Auf der Lay. Magnums only, and at the auctions. 2008 was the first vintage.

I do keep an eye out at Winebid. I won’t buy from Zachys or Acker anymore except under very rare ethics-be-damned circumstances (although the Schwarz M-C category could potentially meet that high standard), which means I don’t track their offerings systematically.

[Jayson_Cohen]

Donnhoff Eiswein. The few I’ve had were spectacular.

They are good. I have a few treasures I’m lining up for post-COVID celebrations, and one of my 2001 OB Eiswein bottles is in play!

[Pau1_M3nk3s]

Hard to choose just one for each category!
For Auslese it would be Dönnhoff Oberhäuser Brucke.
Spätlese pre-2002 Müller-Catoir Haardter Herrenletten.
Kabinett would be Zilliken Saarburger Rausch
Not sure about Trocken/GG, I might go outside of the usual suspects. And for the sweeties it would almost certainly be an MC…and for the above choices please don’t make me select just one!

[Jay_Miller]

I don’t want to hijack this thread, and if you all want I can start a new thread, but I have different question pertaining to this question (for the same audience).

Where do you find yourself buying the majority of your Riesling?

I am really looking for a wine shop that has Riesling diversity.

Vinopolis in Portland is a good source.

If Vinopolis still shipped to NJ I’d be afraid to go anywhere near the Inventory Reduction thread.

[Rodrigo_B]

I don’t want to hijack this thread, and if you all want I can start a new thread, but I have different question pertaining to this question (for the same audience).

Where do you find yourself buying the majority of your Riesling?

I am really looking for a wine shop that has Riesling diversity.

Vinopolis in Portland is a good source.

If Vinopolis still shipped to NJ I’d be afraid to go anywhere near the Inventory Reduction thread.

Depending how you look at it, routing my West Coast purchases through Domaine has been either been a godsend or an inventory reduction nightmare. Lately it’s been seeming more and more like the latter…

[Sarah_Kirschbaum]

If Keller and Egon Muller aren’t allowed, then probably Willi Schaefer kabinett for me, the Graacher Domprobst.

And I would make sure I never wasted a dollar on Cristoffel. Don’t think I’ve ever enjoyed a bottle, at any sweetness level. Just not for me.

I did buy Emrich-Schonleber, but I could still wish I’d bought more!

[K_N_Haque]

Probably Prüm Wehlener Sonnenuhr Spätlese (maybe Kabinett?)

I find the suggestion of Koehler Ruprecht RR always very appealing.

[A_Gillette]

So for the dry wines, if you’re excluding Keller, it has to be Breuer, right? Haven’t fallen in love with the Nonnenberg, but the Berg wines? Wow.
A

[David_Bu3ker]

So for the dry wines, if you’re excluding Keller, it has to be Breuer, right? Haven’t fallen in love with the Nonnenberg, but the Berg wines? Wow.
A

Doesn’t have to be. There are many spectacular dry wines.

[Brian_S_t_o_t_t_e_r]

For off-dry and sweet, I’m with David. I would have loaded up on Schwarz-era Muller-Catoir sweet and halbtrocken so that I wouldn’t have reached today’s state of affairs. I’m down to very few bottles. I would have focused on 1988-1990, 1993s to 1998s, and 2001. That’s a call that is really hindsight because I bought and drank so many in the moment and over the years until supply became scarce, and it’s not enough. (An aside, but this would have included buying more Scheurebe as well.) We could start listing vineyards but if forced to chose one, it’s probably Haardter Burgergarten.

Another obvious choice for me is J-J Christoffel Urziger Wurzgarten from Hans Leo before his retirement after the 2001 vintage at all Pradikat levels.

For a grower family with continuity, I can’t say a Prum or Schaefer wine except to say I blew it on 2001 Prum and I started buying Schaefer consistently a little later than I would have liked. So I’d say Reinhold Haart Goldtropfchen Spatlese. After tasting the 2001 a couple years ago, the only vintage I ever bought on release, I wish I had bought a few of those every year.

One last thought on sweet wines. I would have more systematically tracked down numbered cask Auslesen from von Schubert.

On the dry side, I’m not sure. I’m still learning to appreciate dry German wines, especially those grown on slate. If you exclude Keller, I may have bought more Hermannshohle Trocken / GG from Donnhoff or Schafer-Frolich Felsenberg once Tim came on the scene. (I have plenty of Donnhoff sweet wines.) Back in the day, it was not easy to find dry German wines systematically at retail in the US.

This is something I’ll be focusing on in the future.

[A_Gillette]

So for the dry wines, if you’re excluding Keller, it has to be Breuer, right? Haven’t fallen in love with the Nonnenberg, but the Berg wines? Wow.
A

Doesn’t have to be. There are many spectacular dry wines.

Yes, but that doesn’t really answer the question. To sensibly answer the question the wine not only has to be spectacular but also much harder or much pricier to obtain.

[David_Bu3ker]

So for the dry wines, if you’re excluding Keller, it has to be Breuer, right? Haven’t fallen in love with the Nonnenberg, but the Berg wines? Wow.
A

Doesn’t have to be. There are many spectacular dry wines.

Yes, but that doesn’t really answer the question. To sensibly answer the question the wine not only has to be spectacular but also much harder or much pricier to obtain.

Only if it’s worth it. I have always found Breuer priced beyond its worth.

[A_Gillette]

Doesn’t have to be. There are many spectacular dry wines.

Yes, but that doesn’t really answer the question. To sensibly answer the question the wine not only has to be spectacular but also much harder or much pricier to obtain.

Only if it’s worth it. I have always found Breuer priced beyond its worth.

Good for you David!

[Patrick_Taylor]

Obligatory

If I Could Turn Back Time