Howard, my sht is as smelly as anyone’s. I prefer to manage my sht in a sanitary manner and relatively privately. When people deposit 7000+ sh*ts in a limited area, over the same few hours with inadequate infrastructure…that’s when things can become unpleasant.
If we’re talking about a large mass event (i.e.: a football stadium) that’s one thing. Downtown Key West or Old City Barcelona were not designed for an additional dump of 7000+ tourists on top of a normally busy day of peak season tourism. The same is especially true of tropical islands where cruise ships might be providing important income but the impacts on the environment (often over-burdened by human development to begin with) can be devastating. The magnitude of a tourist influx makes a difference…the smell of an individual’s sh*t, not so much.
Disney is beautifully designed to handle 10s of thousands of tourists simultaneously. Key West and Barcelona could become more Disney-fied, but that would kind of spoil the reason to go…wouldn’t it?
You come on here this morning literally slinging sh*t. I try to lighten the mood and you attack.
Don’t worry Eddie Bauer now sells slim fit khaki travel pants. Just don’t buy the convertible zip off kind. That’s a dead giveaway you’re a tourist.
It’s interesting how you missed the point of the post and made a personal attack in what has been the most civil forum on WB. People here in Travel are polite and generous.
The point of the thread is that you and others believe you are superior to those who go on cruises. At no point was this thread polite and generous. I found it highly insulting from the first post.
Hi Howard
I’ve re-read the posts and no-one, not a single person, has expressed superiority over those who go on cruises. They’ve talked about the effect of mass tourism, and the specifics of the mega-cruise liners, particularly in the strain they put on infrastructure.
I’ve engaged in similar discussions on a travel forum, and also on the hot topic of AirBnB, where customers and non-customers alike discussed the social impact of apartments being lost to locals and the problems this caused to people remaining in the apartment blocks. Just like here, no-one said people shouldn’t do it, nor berated anyone for doing so. No-one took offence and all took the opportunity to reflect on their ‘imprint’.
Environmentalists say toxic emissions from cruise ships pose health risk on Santorini
‘I wouldn’t go to Santorini – it’s a threat to your health’: Greek island under fire over cruise ship emissions
Santorini Implements Further Passenger Limits
These articles have nothing to do with the alleged superiority of non-cruise travelers. They are about the impact of too many massive cruise ships and their passengers on the infrastructure and eco-systems of Santorini, which I’ve witnessed first hand over the past 10 years.
I am a fan of cruises. Particularly Silversea. They have a definite advantage if done correctly. That being said I am also a big fan of staying in one place. Grand Cayman is one of my favorite places and they are seriously discussing a cruise pier (it is tendered now) that would destroy a whole bunch of coral reef.
Hi George
No reason why you couldn’t combine the two (and maybe that’s a regular approach for you already?), e.g. starting with a cruise where the finish point (or somewhere nearby) is somewhere you really want to stay and explore, so you grab 4-5 days there before heading home.
Regards
Ian
Have done that many times. Did it this summer - spent a few days in Stockholm and then took a Silversea cruise to St Petersburg.
Doing it again next summer spending 4 days in the Cote d’Azur and then catching a Silversea cruise in Monaco to head to some of the islands in the Med. Where I have never been. Ending up in Rome for a couple of nights (have been before). We like to use the cruise to explore new places where we may want to go back and stay for awhile.
We also do not do any of the cruise tourist tours. We normally just head off on our own explore a bit, have a nice lunch and relax. If I do take a tour like in St Petersburg, I will book private to avoid crowds as much as possible. It works really well for us.
I have also rented many houses/villas in Europe. Enjoy staying put for a while and living like a local.
George, On our Seabourn Cruise of the Baltic, we booked a two day tour of St. Petersburg with Red October a few years ago and it was fabulous. One of the guides was a Art History Professor at the University and not only did he get us into some special rooms at the Hermitage and explain the significance of the art, but was a fountain of information about all the churches, museums, and historical sites in the city. Highly recommended.
In St Petersburg we had a great private tour guide for 3 full days. Honestly it was a bit much but she was amazing. We walked past every line. I think the regular line for the Hermitage was probably 1/2 mile long… She took me to a real Russian watch store far, far from the tourist areas. Helped me with all my dinner reservations as some places English was not readily spoken. We also had an amazing driver that I swear was former KGB. Quite the experience but now that I have done it don’t think I would go back. Still a great city and I highly recommend it. Having the ship in port for 3 days to use like a hotel was really great.
I think Howard has a point about the implicit complaint here, but one can simultaneously recognize a problem while acknowledging that one is part of the problem. If you don’t think you are part of the global warming problem, you are deluding yourself, but that doesn’t mean that you are disqualified from lamenting the current state of affairs.
Brig: We were in Dubrovnik in October and we were on a cruise ship, albeit a relatively small one. I personally, cannot even contemplate being on one of those mega-ships. Yes, the old town is a bit crowded, but a lot of it is due to the “Game of Thrones” crowd as well as cruise folks. Luckily, we were the only ship in town that day. I found the city amazing and we walked the entire medieval wall surrounding the city in complete peace. In addition, we ate some of the finest seafood I have ever tasted in a beautiful, and virtually empty restaurant called “Proto.” All the while the mediocre, tourist restaurants were absolutely packed. Granted, Proto was a bit more expensive, but the difference in quality and service far surpassed the price differential. We found a similar situation in the shops. There were tons of people in the normal touristy shops and yet the shops featuring beautiful Croatian crafts were very uncrowded and quite reasonable. In addition, the farmers’ market in the middle of the old town was wonderful, featuring the absolute best dried figs I have ever tasted. Overall, and I don’t mean to sound too snobby, you can certainly enjoy Dubrovnik (and other ports as well), despite the presence of cruise ships. One caveat, I must mention, is that since we are retired, we try our best to travel in the “off season.”
Uh oh. I normally think the strategy is to go to remoter parts of the island while they are in town, but if it’s so bad that you are moving on, then I doubt whether I could find a coping strategy.
Brig,
In September we went on our first river cruise - Uniworld from Avignon to Lyon, with three additional nights in Beaune. So good that we booked another from Basel through Germany to Amsterdam this July. Only 158 passengers on board so it is much more like a small luxury hotel than a huge mega ship. The ports we were in welcomed us. The food was great and the service was as close to 5 star as possible, with a couple of flaws to be expected over eight days. I would never take a mega ship cruise but I really enjoyed seeing multiple cities without unpacking each day.
Hi Bruce
That sounds like it addresses many of the criticisms of the massive sea-going cruise liners, plus I daresay the quays on the river were more appealing than most sea ports & closer to the town/village/city centres.
I do like my own space and my own schedule, plus embedding myself more in a local culture, so even something like this would still not appeal to me. However it’s fair to stress the ‘without unpacking everyday’ to which you could add ‘without checking in/out every day’ and other wasted time if trying to achieve the same by bus/rail/flights.
Very good point Ian - not to mention scheduling around check-in times. The river cruises also are mostly American/Canadian tourists so English is not an issue, and at least I can say Uniworld is all-inclusive including shore excursions and tipping. There are usually multiple choices of shore excursions or you can do your own thing with bikes they provide. Now, if their ports don’t work for what you want to see then it is not for you. I think it gives a good overview of the region and with an add-on at the beginning or end, is a great way to see a lot in less than two weeks,
![[cheers.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/0/0ff9bfcdb0964982cd3240b6159868fbdf215b1a.gif "cheers"){kind=small}
