When we got married, a big Mauviel pot was one nice gift. So far, it has lasted. Or should I say that both have lasted, given that today is February 14? ![[snort.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/b/bdc3944606213c4dca6c1169cf0a166c8bc4f8c9.gif "snort.gif"){kind=small}
All purchases like this I calculate to price per use. Something that is $100 and you use once is 10x more expensive than something you buy for $1000 and use 100 times. That’s why you buy a really good bed, office chair, cookwear etc…
I still have 3 pots of original All Clad. The kind with the anodized aluminum exterior and the SS interior, they are great.
If you understand how to cook it really doesn’t matter as long as you have the right material. When I was in my 20s I worked in a brunch restaurant and probably made a thousand omelettes in a mild steel pan that cost me $20. It was the perfect material for that. However a copper pan would probably have impressed the waitresses.
Not your huevos?
Had a bunch of 2.5 mm Mauviel that we bought in France. Ended up putting it on eBay because I always reached for my Demeyer Proline or de Buyer carbon pans. The couple of pieces we kept were small saucepans, where the copper really matters. Wish I gotten them in 3mm.
Why is Demeyer proline better than copper please ?
A cast iron pan will easily outlast its owner and costs less than $20 new at Target. My parents have inexpensive Faberware stock pots that they’ve used for decades and I’ve happily taken off their hands. I don’t think the longevity argument really holds water once you’re past IKEA-quality cookware.
When I speak of diminishing returns, I’m thinking specifically of how much better it performs compared to more economical options, and at the end of the day food doesn’t taste better because it was cooked in a $200 copper saucepan instead of a $70 All-Clad knockoff from Sur la Table.
At least this is what I tell myself when I eye the gorgeous copper pans but spend my money on wine instead. 
To me cast iron doesn’t fall into the same category of cookware as a copper pan as it is a terrible conductor of heat and therefore uneven throughout the pan. This is not to say that cast iron isn’t useful, however if you need to cook something that requires more precision it just isn’t going to hold a candle to other materials.
In regards to All-Clad knockoffs, I can’t really comment as I’ve never owned them. I do love my All-Clads though and find that they are just as good as my Mauviel except for one area of cooking and that is when it comes to low heat cooking/simmering. The copper frying pan can simmer a liquid evenly throughout the pan with no significant hot spot at the flame source whereas the All-Clad will mostly be bubbling at the flame source and little elsewhere. I suppose if you’re cooking with electric or induction then none of this matters ultimately as the whole heat source is even. My conclusion is that if you do enough home-cooking as it is then it’s worth skipping your next 3 or 4 bottles of wine (talk about diminishing returns ![[wow.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/7/7d450e9830889c8943b674446a21b7254cad657e.gif "wow"){kind=small}
) and buying one of these puppies instead. YMMV
Are you saying that money spent on wine is p1ssed away, but not if on a pan?
Quite literally, yes
I have both All-Clads and the knockoffs, and the real difference is in the frying pans. The knock-offs are crap - sticks, tough to clean. For saucepans & stock pots, the difference is negligible and we choose based on which size & shape is best for the task at hand.
We have an electric stove, and when my husband wants even simmering, he reaches for our Staub dutch oven.
This is the sexy beast I’ve never been able to pull the trigger on: Mauviel Copper Fry Pan 2.5mm Skillet M'heritage M250B Bronze Handle | Cutlery and More
I think cookware is a lot like golf clubs.
On a quality continuum, let’s work with: Super excellent – excellent – very good – good – average – below average – bad. That’s a 7 point scale, essentially.
The 7’s and 6’s are significantly and very noticeably better than the 1’s and the 2’s.
1’s should be avoided, and 2’s should be used by folks who aren’t at all serious and/or are dipping their toes in the water to see if they even like the activity for which the tools are to be used.
Most folks could probably make 3’s work for them, although those who are particularly talented at the activity will likely find this quality level very aggravating.
4’s, which can be very affordable, really are plenty good enough for nearly everybody, although the “serious” folks will have to actively employ some “hacks” on a somewhat regular basis.
Performance with the 5’s might not be noticeably better than with the 4’s, but you’re getting better construction.
Nobody “needs” a 7; “need” probably tops-out at 6. And the extra performance one gets out of the 6’s and 7’s is probably lost on 99% of the population at large.
So, to bring it back to golf clubs for a second: a few years ago, I purchased some clubs that I would deem a 6 on the quality scale, and was professionally fitted for them. I have no objective “need” for clubs that nice — I’m simply not “that good.” BUT, I really do enjoy having them, and I get to experience that enjoyment every time I use them. And they work very well for me. The reason I use this analogy is this: there is some value in the enjoyment you will get out of having and using top-of-the-line tools, and that really shouldn’t be discounted.
With how much most of us spend on wine, and with how much most of us in this thread enjoy cooking (and often at a high degree of difficulty/competence), it really strikes me as a no-brainer to buy top-of-the-line cookware if that’s something you’re interested in doing. Sure, that 4 or 5 will probably (not certainly) last as long as the 6’s or 7’s (i.e.: a lifetime), but we’re talking a price difference of a few bucks per year to move up the scale. Just do it. You won’t regret it.
Well on the 1-7 scale i went for an 8
Just ordered a Duparquet copper fry pan lined in silver. Hand made in USA by a real craftsman.
My logic is that im buying a peice of craftsmanship that will function well and be beautiful to look at and work with.
Atta boy! Would love to see some pics when you get it.
Ill post pics next week when i get it, im excited
Lined in silver… So will that tarnish the way silver normally does? I’m confused to the benefit of silver. (clearly not a metallurgist)
They explain it on their website, not cheap!! Silver-Lined Copper Cookware — Duparquet Copper Cookware
Brian. I agree with your golf club analogy. Although I used to golf a lot and was nearly single digit for a while, I always enjoyed having non current clubs. I still play with a set of Cobra irons and hybrids and a Taylor Rocket Balls driver. I do get a lot more pleasure out of cooking then golf. Golf is almost a self inflicted punishment for me. Like owning a French motor car.
I really love the mix of pots and pans that I have bought over the years All Clad, Staub and Le Cruset, but perhaps my favorite is a giant Enameled Dutch Oven from Sur La Table.
It’s not a question of which is better. Each of them does some things better than the other. That’s why I kept my copper saucepans, and sold the saute pans.
Demeyer are easier to clean up and maintain, have better food release, and have more thermal mass to maintain their heat when you throw in a large piece of food (well, at least Proline does. Industry-5 is different).
Stainless lined copper (my Mauviel were stainless, don’t know if they make a tinned line) is better at heat conduction – both in terms of not having any hot spots, and in terms of the pan cooling or heating quickly. These will be of varying value depending on how even your heat source is, and your cooking technique.
When referencing All Clad, I believe that they have gotten thinner over time and may make comparisons difficult. My old Masterchef pieces are noticeably thicker than the current MC2 line or whatever it is called today and I think other lines have gotten thinner as well even if not rebranded.