I have decided not to comment on Dalton’s latest article. After I commented on his last effort, his head exploded, and I had to clean up the mess alone…
More than just throwing out my recent experience in NYC, I think they article is well written. I think the 2 best points were about “shilling”, as I do see that as something that can be a hot water topic as more people find out. The other is the high number of Somms that are out there. Diluted wages due to a competitive market can definitely be a bad thing for a job that doesn’t carry the best hours.
One caveat: Board member suggestions may result in a great bottle of wine at a decent price, but it may not be a good pairing as most of us haven’t had the dish you’ll order (the somm likely has).
Meh. Somms were or are considered a new glamor job position. Now the glamor has faded, and they cry wee-wee-wee all the way home.
I like what Rama said. Have a nice wine by-the-glass program. When I’m dining out with my wife (who seldom drinks), I cannot afford to physically drink an entire bottle. Well chosen glasses can sell themselves.
Or, based upon what I have seen in some selfie-style videos that certain NYC celebrity somms have done, they may band together after work, get drunk and make wee-wee-wee all the way home…
That is a fair point, but many restaurants I’ve been to include on their food menus a suggested wine pairing. A good manager should be able to do that; one doesn’t necessarily need a high-end sommelier just for that purpose.
Bruce
I have a number of friends who are somms here in the LA area and I honor and respect what they do. Do I agree with the wines they choose all of the time? Heck no . . .
The ‘challenge’ is that some somms understand that they are there to serve the needs of their customers, yet others seem to want to ‘push’ certain agendas. They control their lists and oftentimes fill them with obscure or over-priced wines because they can - or because of relationships built up by them with distributors/brokers over the years. Others have no choice - the ‘powers that be’ at the restaurants tell them that they ‘must’ carry certain wines because of contacts/commitments. And there does seem to be ‘group think’ with many somms - one will try something obscure and then you’ll see it posted on Facebook and then on the lists of numerous restaurants in the area in no time, regardless of cuisine, etc . . .
I have been exposed to many cool wines due to somms that, to me, ‘get it’. That said, I agree with what Rama said as well - give me a diverse BTG list so that I can try a diverse selection of wines without having to purchase numerous bottles . . .
Cheers.
Larry, I agree…we know many of the same Somms and people in the biz. There is a herd of people out there that kind of follow the same obsessions; many tend to follow
the same wines. You know what they are. Some are Unicorns, some are wines made by their buddies, etc.
But there are also many out there that feature diverse BTG lists that frequently change that are fun and not expensive. You certainly don’t need a Somm for wine and food pairing, just Managers who care.
What made it interesting for me was Dalton sharing insights based on his ground-level observation/experiences on a subject he knows well. Yes, some of this is happening under the microscope of Manhattan and NY generally and the impact outside of this region would be less of an issue. The one thing he mentioned that involves the industry as a whole is the endless army of newly certificated wine professionals. The same saturation phenomenon has already occurred in culinary programs where the inducement to enroll is that graduates are set for a high-paying, creative and satisfying career. Just a couple weeks ago, this happened - San Francisco culinary school Le Cordon Bleu to close. The reality for most is much different. Introductory Wine Certification levels are well within the reach, financially and time-wise for just about anyone. However, it costs well into five figures and a serious commitment of time to achieve a certification that would be only the first step to put someone on the ‘A-List’ for a Sommelier interview. I get between 4 and 10 emails a week offering wine certification classes.
Lots of great thoughts here as usual. Just a few tweaks.
Somms? Some are good, some are great, some not so much. It’s really hard to have a conversation where I may think of Andy Fortgang (somm, owner) at Le Pigeon in Portland who has a killer btg list, and a really solid bottle list, or I may think of somm B. who has a list with only Slovenian san soufre white wines and Indiginous Italian red varietals. Conversing about “good” and “bad” somms is more about my mood regarding somms than the actual somms.
Certification…is just a start. “Wine” is too big these days and. Certification is like getting a bachelors degree…show me a 20 year professional in any industry that thinks they knew what mattered when they graduated college.
No easy answer…I want my somm, or retail wine person, to be able to run a profitable list but pour me something beautiful when I show up.
I think for many of us the demands on a sommelier are different to what they aspire to.
- I don’t want a 100 page list of wines. 25-200 wines depending on the type of place is plenty. I don’t want to employ a ‘curator’ nor pay for the overheads of stocking and maintaining a substantial cellar.
- Much as it’s great to be able to chat to a fellow geek about wine, it’s not enough to pay for someone to be trained up to that level. I can talk to wine geeks all day long - that’s why I’m here!
- I do appreciate that some thought goes into the wine list and it’s not just the same old standards that a local merchant or national chain wants to promote - or whatever is cheap in the local cash & carry. This for me is where there is value.
- I would always prefer the option of reasonable (both ways) BYO, which is one way that a restaurant can save on capital outlay / dedicated storage. That ties into the smaller lists, such that they need a modest selection for those not too interested in wine.
- Another area a good Somm or wine waiter is of value, is in recognising TCA (or other faults). There are too many instances in restaurants where the staff don’t recognise TCA, and at times it takes the diner to order a 2nd bottle, pour the member of staff a glass of each bottle & let them taste for themselves the difference between a corked bottle and a clean one. I recall one Aussie wine geek who was helping out in a restaurant, who wondered whether he should offer to taste the wine for customers, as he was very sensitive to TCA. An interesting thought. Most customers are even more unused to TCA than staff, and the whole tasting the wine charade is something that really stresses many people.
- Where I would see value in the ‘trendy Somm’ is where there is a strong ‘by the glass’ list. Whereas I’m wary of trusting a stranger to choose me a bottle of wine, I’d be much more open to the idea of taking a recco on a glass. I think a focus here could work very well.
regards
Ian
I have enough wine and my prices are so far below what one would pay at a restaurant that I almost never order wine out and usually bring my own bottles. I have more experience opening old bottles and recognizing wine faults than many newer Somms, and I expect that’s the case of most WB’s.
Having a small child, I don’t get out as much as I used to, but with only a few exceptions, I’m not relying on BTG lists to expand my palate. I would go out of my way for excellent and creative handmade cocktails, but rarely for a wine program.
I am always on the lookout for restaurants where I can get great food and bring lots of bottles for low or absent corkage, and that situation often requires a friendly Somm.
So in general, most Somms are of limited use to me and the recent trend towards popularizing their education and credentialing seems a bit misguided. Ten years ago there was a cadre of maybe 100 people across the country who were really revolutionizing cocktail bartending and reviving classics. Seven years ago there were a thousand. By five years ago the skills and concepts had trickled down to small city bars, corporate chains and casual bartenders, a trend which continues to this day. The same thing is happening with wine knowledge and wine programs. Five years from now, Somm culture will seem a thing of the past, having trickled down to GMs and waitstaff and casual and corporate wine lists everywhere.