Moderate shipping stupidity, Wine Access style.

[John_Glas]

If it is not direct from UPS or FedEx I am not interested. Had one problem with UPS in 20 years and zero with FedEx.

Who are all these third party shippers?

I actually think I know the company that they are using, and they aren’t using UPS and FedEx to ship everywhere. Hence the long delays.

Sorry. I would say to any one the following

1. If you are dealing with someone that won’t hold it during hot months, you probably shouldn’t give them your business.

2. If you are dealing with someone that isn’t using FedEx or UPS to ship to your state, you probably shouldn’t give them your business.

3. If you really need to have it shipped during the hot days, only ship it overnight, or priority overnight. Think of it as insurance more than a shipping charge.

We opened a bunch of wine today that had suspect storage, and the failure rate was through the roof. Corks crumbling, fall in, core of the cork ripping out, it was bad. None of those were good. Even some passively stored bottles that “looked good” were overcome with alcohol, and not enjoyable to drink.

I have never understood shipping in any circumstance in the summer. I know for the trade they need to as they are not hauling wines around for big tastings in different cities. I am sure they have it figured out as I was at a few this summer and no wine had any heat damage.

[John_Glas]

I had the same last month. Wine shipped when it was 100 deg. The shipment was one day, but sat on a truck most of the day. Immediately opened the box and ice pack warm, bottles at 90+ deg.

I posted a thread on this previously that they will ship when temps are up to 95 deg.

That is the problem as if you are not the first delivery of the day the trucks are probably 120 in the sun. My favorite was a local wine shop delivery when it was 98 in Minneapolis and no temp control.

[S_Rose]

I’ll add another three cents to this thread: shippers that say “signature required” and an adult must be present…and then the boxes are left at the door without getting a sig, or ringing the bell. I’ve saved a few early June deliveries thanks to motion alerts from my video doorbell

And sidenote: I’ll shake my fist like Grampa Simpson to all shippers WHO LEAVE BOXES BLOCKING THE FRONT DOOR FROM OPENING

[Ian_Dorin]

If it is not direct from UPS or FedEx I am not interested. Had one problem with UPS in 20 years and zero with FedEx.

Who are all these third party shippers?

I actually think I know the company that they are using, and they aren’t using UPS and FedEx to ship everywhere. Hence the long delays.

Sorry. I would say to any one the following

1. If you are dealing with someone that won’t hold it during hot months, you probably shouldn’t give them your business.

2. If you are dealing with someone that isn’t using FedEx or UPS to ship to your state, you probably shouldn’t give them your business.

3. If you really need to have it shipped during the hot days, only ship it overnight, or priority overnight. Think of it as insurance more than a shipping charge.

We opened a bunch of wine today that had suspect storage, and the failure rate was through the roof. Corks crumbling, fall in, core of the cork ripping out, it was bad. None of those were good. Even some passively stored bottles that “looked good” were overcome with alcohol, and not enjoyable to drink.

I have never understood shipping in any circumstance in the summer. I know for the trade they need to as they are not hauling wines around for big tastings in different cities. I am sure they have it figured out as I was at a few this summer and no wine had any heat damage.

Yeah, they paid for overnight shipping

Folks in the trade aren’t going to chance it.

[Jay_Winton]

UPS and Fedex are back to delivery with signature required at least in my area. Even the UPS delivery guy I know can’t sign for me anymore. Nice while it lasted.

[HoosJustinG]

The way “Cold Chain” is supposed to work is refrigerated 18 wheeler to a local distribution center where ice packs are added and it’s shipped priority overnight to the final destination. It works very well for me in Florida – wine and ice packs are both cool to the touch 12 months/year.

I wonder if it’s possible that some regional distribution centers in areas where it’s not usually hot aren’t as vigilant?

UPS and Fedex are back to delivery with signature required at least in my area. Even the UPS delivery guy I know can’t sign for me anymore. Nice while it lasted.

My UPS guy has no problem signing for me. FedEx says they now need to enter an actual birthday for wine shipments. Our guy knows mine after a few deliveries and also leaves it now.

[Martin_Steinley]

3. Requesting a weather hold could mean I just end up with someone else’s returned cooked wine.

So,

1. You believe that this retailer may cook other customers’ wine and take it back.
2. You believe that they may resell that wine to you and/or others.
3. You buy wine from the retailer and you have them ship it ground to you in Texas in mid-summer, and you expect good results.
   At best, that’s Premier Cru-like hopefulness.

As a retailer, it’s frustrating to have a warehouse bulge during the increasingly-long no-ship period, as logistics within the warehouse become challenging. Also, efficiently maintaining a warehouse cold and humid entails equipment costs and energy costs, although the latter are minimal if the buildout and equipment are good. However, there is no other way to ensure that customers will receive wine in proper condition. Overnight and cold-chain options might work, but with the current state of shipping, there can be no guarantees.

Regarding summer holds, if I were the customer, I would want to know for certain in what conditions my wine is being held.

[Vince_L1]

My few orders from Wine Access have always shipped immaculately and arrived in pristine condition. That being said, I don’t ship any wine from anywhere in the summer. If it’s 90+ outside, it’s a lot hotter in the truck, and it’s not hard to wait for a few months to get the wine.

Alleged UPS Drivers Share Photos of 'Insanely Hot' Temperatures Inside Vans

I just read about this last week

[Michae1_P0wers]

I think this thread is reaching a point of tl;dr, so I will just condense the points I was trying to make:

1) Packing wine with ice gel packs a week before it leaves your warehouse in California is asinine.
2) Promising temperature controlled delivery, but then not providing it, is what it is.
3) Requesting a weather hold could mean I just end up with someone else’s returned cooked wine.

If they had packed the wine the day it left California, we wouldn’t be having this conversation. That’s the “stupidity” I referred to in the original post.

I’m still not sure how you know it was packed a week in advance. Labels are often created far in advance of shipping.

I really don’t trust cold chain or anything of the sort in very high temperatures; there’s just no way to know what it sees along the way. Even though I think wine is typically more robust than the board opinion would suggest, I wouldn’t want to accept wine which arrived with ice packs at 90+ degree temps. The upside in this particular case is that at least with WA they’ll make it right with a new shipment or credit. There are plenty of stories on here with retailers balking at replacements, even when they were supposedly holding until cooler shipping temps. Another piece of advice is to never select holds that ship at the retailer’s discretion, but always pick your own shipping date, ideally with the ability to change that date later if conditions require.

[J_Patrick_Lynch]

I think this thread is reaching a point of tl;dr, so I will just condense the points I was trying to make:

1) Packing wine with ice gel packs a week before it leaves your warehouse in California is asinine.
2) Promising temperature controlled delivery, but then not providing it, is what it is.
3) Requesting a weather hold could mean I just end up with someone else’s returned cooked wine.

If they had packed the wine the day it left California, we wouldn’t be having this conversation. That’s the “stupidity” I referred to in the original post.

I’m still not sure how you know it was packed a week in advance. Labels are often created far in advance of shipping.

I really don’t trust cold chain or anything of the sort in very high temperatures; there’s just no way to know what it sees along the way. Even though I think wine is typically more robust than the board opinion would suggest, I wouldn’t want to accept wine which arrived with ice packs at 90+ degree temps. The upside in this particular case is that at least with WA they’ll make it right with a new shipment or credit. There are plenty of stories on here with retailers balking at replacements, even when they were supposedly holding until cooler shipping temps. Another piece of advice is to never select holds that ship at the retailer’s discretion, but always pick your own shipping date, ideally with the ability to change that date later if conditions require.

I can certainly imagine a system where it is sorted and packed ahead of time and then ice packs are added before it leaves the warehouse. But it would be interesting to see what WA says.

[Michael_Feldman]

If it is not direct from UPS or FedEx I am not interested. Had one problem with UPS in 20 years and zero with FedEx.

Who are all these third party shippers?

Late last year, UPS lost my wine shipment for over a week (from a well regarded winemaker on this board).
There is a separate thread on UPS/FedEx screwups so no guarantees on wine being delivered safely with these 2 companies either.

[Mikko_Tuomi]

I’m still not sure how you know it was packed a week in advance. Labels are often created far in advance of shipping.

I really don’t trust cold chain or anything of the sort in very high temperatures; there’s just no way to know what it sees along the way. Even though I think wine is typically more robust than the board opinion would suggest, I wouldn’t want to accept wine which arrived with ice packs at 90+ degree temps. The upside in this particular case is that at least with WA they’ll make it right with a new shipment or credit. There are plenty of stories on here with retailers balking at replacements, even when they were supposedly holding until cooler shipping temps. Another piece of advice is to never select holds that ship at the retailer’s discretion, but always pick your own shipping date, ideally with the ability to change that date later if conditions require.

I am not talking about the label, that was created few days after it was packed.

I am referring to the packing sheet inside the box, it’s the second picture on the first post. It says it was packed 7-31-2022. Label was created on the 3rd. It left CA on the 6th, arrived to TX afternoon of 9th, and I received it on the 10th. If the wine was packed with the ice packs on the 6th and it was temperature controlled - as promised - we wouldn’t have this issue.

[Michae1_P0wers]

I think this thread is reaching a point of tl;dr, so I will just condense the points I was trying to make:

1) Packing wine with ice gel packs a week before it leaves your warehouse in California is asinine.
2) Promising temperature controlled delivery, but then not providing it, is what it is.
3) Requesting a weather hold could mean I just end up with someone else’s returned cooked wine.

If they had packed the wine the day it left California, we wouldn’t be having this conversation. That’s the “stupidity” I referred to in the original post.

I’m still not sure how you know it was packed a week in advance. Labels are often created far in advance of shipping.

I really don’t trust cold chain or anything of the sort in very high temperatures; there’s just no way to know what it sees along the way. Even though I think wine is typically more robust than the board opinion would suggest, I wouldn’t want to accept wine which arrived with ice packs at 90+ degree temps. The upside in this particular case is that at least with WA they’ll make it right with a new shipment or credit. There are plenty of stories on here with retailers balking at replacements, even when they were supposedly holding until cooler shipping temps. Another piece of advice is to never select holds that ship at the retailer’s discretion, but always pick your own shipping date, ideally with the ability to change that date later if conditions require.

I can certainly imagine a system where it is sorted and packed ahead of time and then ice packs are added before it leaves the warehouse. But it would be interesting to see what WA says.

I would see that as being far more likely than anyone adding ice packs several days in advance. Obviously it was still exposed to a lot of heat at some point to get those ice packs so hot, but I still see this as the most probable scenario.

[Eric_White]

Joe Fisch

[Mikko_Tuomi]

I would see that as being far more likely than anyone adding ice packs several days in advance. Obviously it was still exposed to a lot of heat at some point to get those ice packs so hot, but I still see this as the most probable scenario.

I don’t believe that’s probable at all. The ice packs were at the bottom. You are saying they pack the wine but leave the box open, then someone pulls the wines out, puts the ice packs in, repacks the wine, and then ships it? It’s not a very plausible scenario. The idea of the packing label is that it’s put in there when the box is sealed as a method of controlling the contents.

The ice packs won’t heat up to 100F in 3 days inside styrofoam.

Saying “you shouldn’t get wine shipped in the summer” is giving them leeway from what they promise. I get wine delivered from WDC throughout the summer and so far haven’t had any issues.

[Mikko_Tuomi]

And to follow up, they have now replied to my email. As expected, they are offering a refund.
Does not change the point of this thread though. They did not provide the service they promised.

[Markus_S]

Would NEVER ship in August, unless I lived in the Southern Hemisphere.

[Robert.A.Jr]

Fine, but you still roll the dice for every shipment to Texas in the summer, regardless of the vendor’s promise. You can keep having wine shipped in 100F heat and complain when it doesn’t work out, or ship only in the fall and spring when the rest of us do for safety and no longer have these complaints. To me it seems like a simple decision.

This. Always.

[Peter_C]

UPS and Fedex are back to delivery with signature required at least in my area. Even the UPS delivery guy I know can’t sign for me anymore. Nice while it lasted.

Try taping a piece of paper to the door they deliver to with your name and number, stating that this note serves as your signature for release and to call with any issues. I’ve done that 10ish times in MA without a problem .

[Dennis_Borczon]

If it is not direct from UPS or FedEx I am not interested. Had one problem with UPS in 20 years and zero with FedEx.

Who are all these third party shippers?

I actually think I know the company that they are using, and they aren’t using UPS and FedEx to ship everywhere. Hence the long delays.

Sorry. I would say to any one the following

1. If you are dealing with someone that won’t hold it during hot months, you probably shouldn’t give them your business.

2. If you are dealing with someone that isn’t using FedEx or UPS to ship to your state, you probably shouldn’t give them your business.

3. If you really need to have it shipped during the hot days, only ship it overnight, or priority overnight. Think of it as insurance more than a shipping charge.

We opened a bunch of wine today that had suspect storage, and the failure rate was through the roof. Corks crumbling, fall in, core of the cork ripping out, it was bad. None of those were good. Even some passively stored bottles that “looked good” were overcome with alcohol, and not enjoyable to drink.

This. If they won’t hold it until September, I don’t do business with them. And I live in a Northern tier state.