Funny as I actually import wine glasses for a living, so I might qualify for the coveted nerd status after all 
Hmmm - my father would have known how to pronounce it.
I actually agree that Hárslevelű can be more interesting in some respects. There’s a group of wine makers in Tokaj who feel that way too - that it was unfairly designated a second-tier grape and it should be given more respect.
But there are a lot of great grapes over there, and have fun with the pronunciation!
Cserszegi Fűszeres, for example, is a really aromatic white grape that makes a really nicely refreshing wine, although sometimes needs a little more acidity. A lot of times it will have a bit of RS that makes it a crowd-pleasing wine, usually very friendly and not high in alcohol. It has a touch of lychee sometimes, but not to the degree that Gwertz does and the good ones aren’t as disappointing as Gwertz often tends to be.
Irsai Olivér too, which is a parent of the Cserszegi, is another of those aromatic grapes that produces an easy -drinking wine. I’m not completely certain, but I think there’s some Muscat ancestry there, which accounts for the beautiful aromatics.
Then there’s Juhfark, which is grown only in Somló around an old extinct volcano. It’s not as aromatic but really truly deserves a wider distribution as it’s a very unique grape. It’s fairly thin-skinned and perhaps could make a botrytized wine, but I’m not aware of any. But it does possess sufficient acidity to please most anyone, while also having some flavor in addition to the acidity - think sour plums or citrusy fruits.
Of course, if you’re over there, these aren’t all that unusual. It’s only to people outside the country that they’re exotic. Much like many things in life I suppose!
That sparks a memory of a great article by a guy who spent a week there. It’s on vinography and called Volcano‘s Elixir. No tasting notes but very atmospheric. Thanks GregT, I’ve just ordered a few bottles to try it out!
(edited to correct typo in article name)
Robert. Cot = Malbec? I have had the ones from Cahors. They need tons of time to get those incredible tannins tamed. Not at all like the South American version. That Pepiere must be from the Loire somewhere. Any ideas of location? Thanks.
Please note that I have pleaded to Otto to preferably blind me at least every now and then with something that could at least theoretically be recognized (and I also would not oppose to the wines actually tasting good). However to answer your question I can happily suggest that you get to know Savoie’s wines (at least whites) a bit. They are mostly affordable, interesting and easy to find online within the EU. The following styles are worth trying:
Roussette de Savoie (and wines from other appellations made with the Altesse grape)
Chignin-Bergeron (made from the Roussanne grape but generally have better acidity and less weight than the Rhône versions, although also bigger versions are also made here)
Chignin (can be red or white, the latter are made from the local Jacquère grape)
Apremont (whites mostly made from Jacquère. Generally bone dry, low ABV with good acidity, Muscadet-esque if you will)
Vin des Allobroges (well, more specifically Domaine des Ardoisières, a really good address for seriously interesting Alpine whites and reds with tons of character)
If Pet-Nats are your thing some really good onea are made within the Bugey-Cerdon appellation which is sometimes considered to be part of Savoie but then some consider Bugey to be a region of its own.
Of course just like everywhere else you should focus on good growers and not buy blindly.
Pinot blanc is almost genetically identical to pinot noir by DNA? I think the fact that you can find this mutation in an area where pinot noir is predominate is pretty geeky. Also unique. I guess that is the reason that the Gouge family put their name to it. I can’t think of another area where you can find pinot blanc or pinot gris distributed amongst its parent, pinot noir.
If you can’t think of another area where Pinot Blanc or Pinot Gris would be planted alongside Pinot Noir doesn’t mean such places don’t exist. There are several other vineyards in Burgundy where small amounts of Pinot Blanc is planted, although Pinot Gris seems to be less common. However, for example Alsace and the Aube region in Champagne are classic examples of French regions where Pinot Noir, Pinot Blanc and Pinot Gris grow side-by-side. Also you can find all those varieties growing in Alto Adige and throughout Germany. Nothing geeky in that.
And yes, Pinot Blanc, Pinot Noir, Pinot Gris and Pinot Meunier are all virtually identical to each other from a genetic point of view.
Thanks for the tips! Have ordered some domaine des Ardoisières to try it out. Will let you know my degree of enthusiasm when tasting
Yes, Malbec, but from Loire. Love a good one from Cahors, but yea, definitely need time. Not a fan of the South American ones that I have tried.
Cool, looking forward to your note. It’s been a while since I had their wines but I’ve enjoyed them in both colors.
![[good.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/f/f84c5acc11486ee4baba6dee6cf61dbd133abb18.gif "thumbsup"){kind=small}
Le cot au vin!
One of the leading French producers for nerds is Robert Plageoles - his entire production consists I think of wines made with local grapes which have disappeared (or nearly) elsewhere. I’ve only tried the Prunelart red, which I liked, and the Ondenc white, which I loved.
2 pages and no mention of pineau d’aunis or menu pineau? Shame!
I’m sure everyone was leaving the field clear for you to chime in, Jay 
Chris, I’m glad you enjoyed the Koshu. I’ve only had one—4 years ago, from Bernard Magrez’ project there:
"2010 Magrez-Aruga Koshu Isehara
So the thing is, when I was in Bordeaux in 2014 and visiting at Pape Clement, they had this on the shelf. I absolutely had to grab a bottle and it cemented my decision to have a “Final Frontiers” table. Koshu is the traditional Japanese grape. Read on, brave souls. The nose reminds me a bit of leeks and there’s also a scented soap thing here mixed with some lemongrass. Not offensive, just interesting. But on the palate, well now. Very flowery—almost liquid potpourri—drinking this cold is a must and it’ll never be mistaken for Grand Cru burg, but it is fresh and giving in its own gentle way. In fact, later, it’s orange blossom and orange….and a dead ringer for a Muskat."
Not ultra-nerdy, but Uruguayan Tannat?
A little while ago I arranged a SW France tasting where I had couple of those Plageoles wines (including that Prunelart). Good and quite nerdy wines. And Plageoles is not the only one - Domaine d’Escausses has also a range full of varietal wines made of obscure, endangered local varieties.
A great point! Two of the great geeky Loire varieties! I think Romorantin fits this group perfectly, too.
I’ve had that wine as well - although the vintage 2011, not 2010. Of the few dozen Koshus I’ve had, that might be the lousiest. Which is a surprise, since Katsunuma Jozo (the producer of Aruga Branca) makes some of the most spectacular Koshu wines, too. I guess co-operating with Bernard Magrez didn’t help with the quality.
Not ultra-nerdy, but Uruguayan Tannat?
Nah. Their country might grant the wines some geek appeal, but it all disappears once the wine hits your palate. At least all the Uruguayan Tannat wines I’ve had have been very boring new world wines that just happen to be from a country other than Chile or Argentina. Honestly every single French Tannat I’ve tasted has been better than any of the Uruguayan wines I’ve had. The same problem has been with most of the Chinese and Thai wines I’ve had as well.
The dry Liatiko from Domaine Economou (Crete) is pretty nerdy. I’ve only had it once at a local wine bar that direct imports, and haven’t found it since. Right now not a single listing on wine-searcher. Definitely worth trying - velvety red reminiscent of good mature village Burgundy on the front end; slightly leaner, more floral and tannic finish that reminded me of Piemonte wines.
Unpopular opinion (for this thread at least): Obscure grapes used in winemaking are usually obscure for good reason.
Please note the used of the adverb “usually” in the preceding sentence.
Now my nerdy sense is tingling!
It certainly applies to some varieties. Having tasted some 500 different grape varieties (about 3/4 of them as varietal wines), there’s a good deal of varieties that have fallen into obscurity for a good reason - they are just dull, plain and flabby without much character or distinction to them.
However, many varieties have fallen into obscurity because of the difficulty of cultivation or poor yields, not because of their poor quality. These were historically replaced by high-yielding workhorse varieties that churned out tons of boring, insipid wine just because it was easier. Other varieties produced poor wines back then, due to cooler climate, but now things are starting to change on that front. It is only now that so many producers are trying to recover those lost high-quality varieties that can actually produce wines of great distinction. Just for an example: I’m very happy how a small handful of producers have managed to save varieties like Timorasso and Nascetta from extinction, since those varieties can produce much more distinctive white wines than probably any other white variety in Piedmont.
Thank you, that’s excellent perspective.