TN: Is Bordeaux 2000 still going strong?

WINE TALK
21

2000 Rauzan Segla is my Bordeaux of the year so far.

22

The 2000 PLL I’ve had twice in as many years; it has been consistently elegant and delicious

On the other hand, the 2000 Sociando I had a few years back was really aggressively, unpleasantly green. I remember Alfert mentioning that the 2001 is nicer, with a better balance between the green and the fruit (I’ve not had it myself)

IMO there is little equivalence between the two - one is a well-executed stylistic choice, the other is misstep [shrug.gif]

23

Well, the Pichon-Lalande here did show a hint of herbaceous greenness in the nose, but nothing in the taste - and many other wines in this tasting showed much more greenness.

And, well, Lalande is definitely elegant and sophisticated by all means, but it also came across as rather modern in the final flight of 4 Pauillac wines (Batailley, Lalande, Baron, Mouton): very soft, silky and fruit-forward character with a rather noticeable, glossy oak sheen. All the other wines were less soft, drier in taste and had less noticeable oak influence. Of course one could call it just Lalande being very Lalande, but to me the impression was that of a rather modern, oak-and-fruit-forward Bordeaux, not that of a tough, lean and cold old-school claret.

I myself love herbaceous greenness and that definitely is one of the defining elements of a classic old-school Bordeaux (along with the dry, savory fruit and firm tannins). However, this Lalande definitely was not particularly herbaceous, but instead quite voluptuous with the ripe, solar fruit to the fore.

Many in the tasting considered Baron quite impressive, but I think I was one of the few that actually loved it. I don’t know how it has performed in the past, but it was no crowdpleaser here; the wine was very tightly-knit with assertive tannins and savory tones. If anything, Pichon-Lalande was a crowdpleaser compared to this, tasting them side-by-side.

And not all of the 2000’s Bdx seemed to be outliving us all - for example Batailley and PrieurĂ©-Lichine most likely won’t be improving that much from here. However, in all likelihood most wines tasted that evening will keep very nicely for decades more.

24

Otto. Very strong as usual.

25

Many tasters complained about green notes in 2000 PLL when it was young.

26

I think the 2000 Figeac is pretty green as well. Almost overly herbaceous.

27

What does PLL mean ?

28

Pichon LaLande

29

Acronym police here. It’s **Pichon-L**ongueville, [au Comtesse de] **L**alande

30

Had a 2000 Haut-Bergey last night whish was good.

2000 ChĂąteau Haut-Bergey - France, Bordeaux, Graves, Pessac-LĂ©ognan (12/10/2020)
Last bottle PnP and drunk with meatloaf. Very nice mature Bordeaux with nice fruit, secondary flavors and good balance. Drink or hold. (91 pts.)

Posted from CellarTracker

31

Doesn’t this makes you the abbreviation police, as acronyms are generally meant to form a word pronounced as such? [pillow-fight.gif]

ac·ro·nym
/ˈakrəˌnim/
noun
an abbreviation formed from the initial letters of other words and pronounced as a word (e.g. NASA).

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32

Look at Blanquito sticking up for the Country Squire, going toe-to-toe with the esteemed Ivy Leaguer!

33

Well Keith’s correction of the abbreviation would still stand. He just committed a common sin of those who act the Mrs. Grundy with others, making errors while trying to be impressive by correcting the errors of others.

34

Thank you for that stunning review.
2000 vintage is (like 1996) one of last so called classic vintages. 2001 may be also included.
Was short one money these days but bought as much as i was able to afford these days.
Happy i was able to put my hands on cases of Pichon Baron, Leo Barton and Poyferre, Branaine and Beychevelle, Domaine de Chevalier, Sociando Mallet, Poujeaux and Chasse Spleen.
As you have shown Pichon and Chasse Spleen performed excellent in your tasting and i am glad to own both. Sure they all will perform nicely for next 20 years to come.
Sante.

35

Had it blind last weekend, here was my note on the 2000 LLC:

Decanted for an hour and served blind in Zalto bdx stems. Light sediment and minimal bricking. Very expressive nose of library must, tobacco, a little pencil shaving. Dark core of black fruit remains well in tact with a green streak. Still with plenty of tannic structure but not in a distracting way at all. I was actually thinking 90 Gruaud Larose here, because I felt this bottle had matured a good deal but still had a sturdy frame and some rusticity. I know some folks say they have never had a fully resolved LLC, but I truly think this one will come around eventually, maybe in about 10 years. Decant for sediment as well if you’re ready to take a peek. 94

My friend, a fellow enthusiast (who needs to get on WB) was more enthusiastic and offered a different take when he tasted the same bottle 48 hours later: “words don’t do this wine justice. This is twice as good as when opened 2 days prior. The bouquet completely opened up and now dominates your interest. The wine has black fruit bursting out. The lead pencil of more youthful medocs has given way to sweet tobacco and saddle leather. There is some warmth in the midpalate suggestive of incense. This is a monster of fruit, spice and structure that will last 50 years” 98

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36

Hey Jurgen. I think PLL is always green when young and often green when old. This is what, IMO, lends such beautiful complexity to the ‘82, ‘86, ‘89, the grossly underrated 1990, and the ‘96. I think leaving a little greenness in a wine lends to some more interesting aromatics as the wine gets older. PLL is a great example of that. Others I can think of are Togni’s Cab, Sociando Mallet (which never achieves the same refinement of PLL IMO) and top Cab Francs from the Loire. Some people hate it and think it’s some flaw. I totally disagree. Different strokes


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37

I haven’t had 2000 LLC for many years — but, based on the last bottle, I would think it needs at least another decade. LLC is always slow to come around. I remember the 1982 at age 20 was built like a brick sh*thouse.

38

A big amen to this, to be sure.

Another wine that I love with lots of greenery is mid-80’s Beychevelle. No idea how these showed young, but the pyrazines in the, say, the 85 is an essential component of its complexity, freshness and (possibly) longevity.

39

Like Keith I raised my eyebrows at the title of this thread, since I think 2000 is a vintage that at the high end will go 50 years easy and some of the bigger wines are just starting to open up. I think it’s a great vintage and if anything is still underrated. It is common now to assume that vintages like 2005 and 2010 are superior to 2000 but I think the jury is very much still out on that. I don’t think 2000 had the same level of issues with over-extraction/over-ripeness and excessive alcohol/Parkerization that those vintages did. It strikes me as a much more classically styled vintage, particularly on the right bank but really also on the left. As Nikolai said, I wonder whether we will ever see such a beautifully classic vintage again. While 2000 has taken a while to come around, especially at the top levels, I have had so many great experiences with low level (sometimes very low level) Haut-Medocs and lower-classified St. Emilions and the like that I have no doubt that it will come through.

This is a great TN. It really captures the contrast between the 100 point nose for this wine and the palate, which is still somewhat tough and ornery. If you had been able to sit with just this wine over the whole night the palate might have opened up more. If the palate ever equals the nose this will be even more of an all-time great wine than it already is. I still have six bottles left from my original purchase of this upon release – I really regret not getting more since it was super affordable at release but prices have now escalated hugely.

Threads like this of course destroy my chance of ever sneaking in a lowball bid at auction on this wine, so thanks for that [snort.gif]

40

Totally agree, and would go so far as to say if you don’t have some green/herbal notes in a Cab that’s a problem.

I loved the 2000 PLL the one time I had it exactly for that great green quality and the counterpoint it provided to the fruit.

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