Wine from Normandy?

[Jonathan_Loesberg]

Think Calvados or Armagnac for Normandy. These are more like cognac than like wine and a good Armagnsc will be nearer $100. You should be able to find Calvados for $40-50. If you want wine, given what you and she like, I’d look for a Bordeaux.

Uh … Armagnac is from Gascony, not Normandy. Other end of the country.

And Armagnac and Calvados are more like Cognac than like wine . . . because they’re all brandies!

My mistake about Armagnac, though I wouldn’t say that Gascony is the other side of the country from France. It is substantially farther south.

As to saying they are like cognac, my point was to guide the OP, not to get into a definitional pissing contest, which you have done about Calvados. The issue, I would guess, is that some definitions of brandy limit it to being distilled from grapes and Calvados is distilled from apples. The internet does seem to agree with you and not Otto, though, in defining brandy as being distilled from grape or other fruit juices. I’m agnostic on such questions, as they are rather like arguing about whether Bourbon can only be made in Kentucky, so if there is more arguing to be done, it will be without me.

[Chris_Blum]

Think Calvados or Armagnac for Normandy. These are more like cognac than like wine and a good Armagnsc will be nearer $100. You should be able to find Calvados for $40-50. If you want wine, given what you and she like, I’d look for a Bordeaux.

Uh … Armagnac is from Gascony, not Normandy. Other end of the country.

And Armagnac and Calvados are more like Cognac than like wine . . . because they’re all brandies!

Uh… Calvados isn’t brandy.

In what way is Calvados not brandy???

[John_Morris]

Think Calvados or Armagnac for Normandy. These are more like cognac than like wine and a good Armagnsc will be nearer $100. You should be able to find Calvados for $40-50. If you want wine, given what you and she like, I’d look for a Bordeaux.

Uh … Armagnac is from Gascony, not Normandy. Other end of the country.

And Armagnac and Calvados are more like Cognac than like wine . . . because they’re all brandies!

Uh… Calvados isn’t brandy.

Strange they call Calvados an Apple brandy while defining brandy as distilled wine. A contradiction in terms it seems. Calvados is distilled cider AFAIK.

Odd - I don’t know who says that brandy is limited to distilled wine. It can be made from either wine or fermented fruits, such as apples. Poir Williams is also a brandy. Eau de vie is a subcategory of brandy.

[John_Morris]

. . . Uh … Armagnac is from Gascony, not Normandy. Other end of the country. . . .

My mistake about Armagnac, though I wouldn’t say that Gascony is the other side of the country from France. It is substantially farther south.

I said the other end of the country, not the other side.

[Howard_Cooper]

Think Calvados or Armagnac for Normandy. These are more like cognac than like wine and a good Armagnsc will be nearer $100. You should be able to find Calvados for $40-50. If you want wine, given what you and she like, I’d look for a Bordeaux.

Uh … Armagnac is from Gascony, not Normandy. Other end of the country.

And Armagnac and Calvados are more like Cognac than like wine . . . because they’re all brandies!

Uh… Calvados isn’t brandy.

As I have understood it, brandy is a distillate from a fruit and liquor is a distillate from a grain. If this is correct, Calvados would be brandy.

[Howard_Cooper]

Nathan, very thoughtful gift idea.

I’m with those recommending a Cabernet-based red from Bordeaux. She was probably drinking red wine from somewhere in France other than Normandy. Based on your description of her preferences, I’m guessing she’d enjoy a Bordeaux. The Lanessan recommendation above is a good one. Meyney and Sociando Mallet are also good, a bit of a step up in quality IMO, and still in your price range. The 2014, 2015, and 2016 vintages are all available and are all good. These are wines that can improve with age but are drinkable now. The 2015 might be the most open and user friendly at this young stage.

This. If she was drinking Cabernet based wine, it was likely from Cabernet Sauvignon rather than Cabernet Franc. Wines from Cabernet Franc can be quite good, but they tend to be liked more by people with a lot of wine experience rather than people with a more casual interest in wine. Thus, I would follow David’s suggestion and buy her a Bordeaux. Given how large a wine region Bordeaux is, that is probably what she was drinking if she had Cabernet in Normandy.

[Otto_Forsberg]

Odd - I don’t know who says that brandy is limited to distilled wine. It can be made from either wine or fermented fruits, such as apples. Poir Williams is also a brandy. Eau de vie is a subcategory of brandy.

To my knowledge, “brandy” is always defined as distilled wine. And wine is made from grapes.

If it’s made from other fruits, it’s fruit brandy. The same distinction as between wine and fruit wine. It’s perfectly ok to call Calvados as apple brandy. But not just brandy. I’d be upset if I ordered a glass of brandy in a bar and got a glass of kirsch or slivovitz.

And to my knowledge, brandy is a subcategory of eau-de-vie. Eau-de-vie is any fruit distillate, while brandy is distillate from grape must (not pomace) - normally aged in barrels as well.

As I have understood it, brandy is a distillate from a fruit and liquor is a distillate from a grain. If this is correct, Calvados would be brandy.

Liquor is a hypernym for any dry distillate above 20% ABV.

[Chris_Blum]

C’mon Otto, that’s like saying Framboise isn’t an ale because you’d be upset if you “walked into a bar, ordered a pint of ale and you got a Lindemans” or saying a rauchbier isn’t beer for the same reason.

[Julian_Marshall]

While on holiday in Normandy this year I came across wines from this producer in a shop in Trouville: https://www.arpents-du-soleil.com/

That said I managed to resist the temptation while there and focused on drinking the rather tasty local ciders

Quite right, Ilkkal! This is the only producer I’ve ever heard of - supposed to be quite good, actually, but sadly not available in the US according to Winesearcher. I would choose something from the Loire instead.

[John_Morris]

Odd - I don’t know who says that brandy is limited to distilled wine. It can be made from either wine or fermented fruits, such as apples. Poir Williams is also a brandy. Eau de vie is a subcategory of brandy.

To my knowledge, “brandy” is always defined as distilled wine. And wine is made from grapes.

If it’s made from other fruits, it’s fruit brandy.

Sorry, but “brandy” in English encompasses distillates made from other fruits:

alcoholic beverage distilled from wine or fermented fruit juice - > Brandy Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster

A strong alcoholic spirit distilled from wine or fermented fruit juice. - > Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

a spirit distilled from wine or from the fermented juice of grapes or of apples, peaches, plums, etc. - > Brandy Definition & Meaning | Dictionary.com

Brandy, alcoholic beverage distilled from wine or a fermented fruit mash. - > Brandy | Description, History, & Facts | Britannica

Brandy in general means any kind of distilled spirit, made from fermented fruit juice. The fruit in question is often grapes, but there are a number of Brandies based on apples, pears and other sweet fruits. - > Brandy vs. Cognac vs. Armagnac » What's The Difference?

[Otto_Forsberg]

C’mon Otto, that’s like saying Framboise isn’t an ale because you’d be upset if you “walked into a bar, ordered a pint of ale and you got a Lindemans” or saying a rauchbier isn’t beer for the same reason.

To my understanding lambics are not classified as ales, so I’d be very confused if somebody poured me a framboise when I’m ordering an ale.

Rauchbier, on the other hand, most certainly is a beer.

I really fail to see what point you are trying to make with your comparisons.

[Otto_Forsberg]

Sorry, but “brandy” in English encompasses distillates made from other fruits:

alcoholic beverage distilled from wine or fermented fruit juice - > Brandy Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster

A strong alcoholic spirit distilled from wine or fermented fruit juice. - > Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

a spirit distilled from wine or from the fermented juice of grapes or of apples, peaches, plums, etc. - > Brandy Definition & Meaning | Dictionary.com

Brandy, alcoholic beverage distilled from wine or a fermented fruit mash. - > Brandy | Description, History, & Facts | Britannica

Brandy in general means any kind of distilled spirit, made from fermented fruit juice. The fruit in question is often grapes, but there are a number of Brandies based on apples, pears and other sweet fruits. - > Brandy vs. Cognac vs. Armagnac » What's The Difference?

Yes, well, apparently term “wine” also includes fruit wines as well - at least according to these same sources. So if you are happy with that.

[Jonathan_Loesberg]

I told you people. The facts are not in dispute. The argument over definition is circular. Have fun, though.

[John_Morris]

As I have understood it, brandy is a distillate from a fruit and liquor is a distillate from a grain.

Actually, brandy is a type of liquor. Liquor encompasses brandy (from fruits, including grapes) and whiskies and vodkas (from grains or vegetables). Definitions of “liquor”:

a usually distilled rather than fermented alcoholic beverage - > Liquor Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster



Liquor (also hard liquor, hard alcohol, spirit, or distilled drink) is an alcoholic drink produced by distillation of grains, fruit, or vegetables that have already gone through alcoholic fermentation. - > Liquor - Wikipedia

Now can we get back on topic and argue about the definition of wine?

[Howard_Cooper]

As I have understood it, brandy is a distillate from a fruit and liquor is a distillate from a grain.

Actually, brandy is a type of liquor. Liquor encompasses brandy (from fruits, including grapes) and whiskies and vodkas (from grains or vegetables). Definitions of “liquor”:

a usually distilled rather than fermented alcoholic beverage - > Liquor Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster



Liquor (also hard liquor, hard alcohol, spirit, or distilled drink) is an alcoholic drink produced by distillation of grains, fruit, or vegetables that have already gone through alcoholic fermentation. - > Liquor - Wikipedia

Then is the term for distilled drinks from grain whiskey?

[John_Morris]

Whisky is one grain distillate. But vodka can also be made from grains, as can Chinese baijiu (sorghum, rice, wheat), so not all liquors derived from grain are whisky.

[Jonathan_Loesberg]

Or even whiskey.

[Dan_Kravitz]

to Nathan S,

Back on topic. As others have mentioned, there are essentially no red wines from Normandy.

Your best options:
Artisanal cider from Normandy
Red wine, Cabernet based from Bordeaux - the suggestion of 2016 Chateau Lanessan is impeccable
Red wine, Cabernet based from the Loire - A little closer to Normandy in both geography and climate. A Bourgeuil from Xavier et Agnes Amirault could be both admirable and interesting. Look for a wine from the 2015 vintage at ~$25 - 40.

Happy hunting and have a good Christmas.

Dan Kravitz

[Nathan_S]

Thank you all so much for all the information! To be honest it is a bit overwhelming, but I’m trying to make sense of it all!

One thing I’m now considering because time is getting close with Christmas is I might wait and buy her some Normandy Cider for her birthday. However, would the wines suggested here be ok to wait until October 2020 to open? I’m thinking now that for Christmas I will buy her a bottle of something a put a note on it saying it’s supposed to be opened on October 18, 2020. That will be the one year anniversary of the day we first met. This will give me more time to find a Normandy Cider because I’m from a rural area of Kentucky, so my options might be limited locally in regards to cider.

Thanks again, all!

[Dan_Kravitz]

Nathan,

Yes, Normandy cider is perfect, if you can find it in rural Kentucky (depending where you are, board members can probably recommend places where you can find it).

Any of the wines mentioned will be good, and in fact improve, for many years, in the case of Lanessan, for decades.

Dan Kravitz