Boy, if that post is what this is all about, I don’t understand the point. Seems pretty balanced and respectful to me. I have read worse things (much worse things) said on Burgundy threads by Burgundy lovers about Burgundies Rovani loved.
Nothing in post 33, so it must be post 30 which Chris quoted. But even there, it’s hardly anything I would call an “indictment” against Marcassin. Anyway, there are innumerable posts on Burg threads about the “AFWE,” etc. So it seems a bit silly to be chastising Burgundy drinkers for allegedly lambasting all other wines. Ridiculous, IMHO. Oh well, carry on.
None of us can focus on all the wines from all regions or even close to that. I think most of us tend to fall in love with one of more regions and learn about those regions. We learn who to buy, who not to buy, etc., and it isn’t always even a measure of quality as much as style. Other regions, where one has not put in the time and effort, is a minefield. Certainly, Calfornia Pinot is a minefield to me. I typically don’t really like the wines that much so I really haven’t really put in the effort to find ones I might like. And, I am not really interested in putting forth more effort. I cannot afford to buy or have time to drink all the Burgundies I want.
But, that does not mean I only drink Burgundy. I drink Bordeaux, German wines, California Cabernet, wines from Alsace, wines from the Loire, an occasional Piedmont wine and now even an occasional wine from Sicily. But, I doubt I am ever going to like high alcohol wines with lots of new oak. I don’t like them from Burgundy, from Bordeaux or from California. I try to stay away from threads about specific wines in this ilk or about which of this type of wine to buy because I have nothing to add. But, when a thread is about styles and what makes a great wine or something like that, I feel I have a right to state my views.
There is considerable sentiment here that if you don’t like a wine that someone else has posted favorably about, you should STFU and go read something else. It seems to me there is a great difference between (a) having a negative opinion about a wine, and (b) putting down people that happen to like that wine. I think the Wineberserkers community is enhanced by (a) but not by (b). But there are a lot of people that react very negatively toward (a).
This seems to be the second thread (on my count) this week of non-burgundy drinkers bashing burgundy drinkers. How many threads have been started this week where burgundy drinkers bash non burgundy wines?
This is the kind of quote that seems most common to me. It’s the anti-Burgundians who tend to level the personal attacks. Though I can’t say I read the Marcassin/KB/Sea Smoke threads, so I don’t know what’s posted there.
It’s a great distinction. Would you agree that this statement is squarely in category (b), even though a much milder-than-usual example?
Some people like big, sweet pinots and they are blown away by intensity and concentration of fruit and heady aromas even if the wine lacks of elegance, balance, acidity,minerality. Others, myself included, appreciate these latter qualities, tend to favor Burgundy
I don’t think you have to be hypersensitive to read that statement in the manner that the original poster did, if indeed that is what he is responding to. If you like Marcassin or KB, then you don’t care if wines lack elegance, balance, acidity and minerality, whereas people who appreciate those things favor Burgundy.
I don’t think anyone would have cared if the poster had said “I’ve tried Marcassin pinots several times, and they aren’t my style, I find them too sweet and concentrated lacking in acidity and elegance.”
For an example of what I am describing in Burgundy threads, see
Post 44 Which is the most elegant Burgundy producers? - WINE TALK - WineBerserkers
For an example of why I think Burgundy lovers have been pretty respectful about pinot, see
Chris, you have been reading wine boards too long to think that anyone talks like that. I really don’t have a problem with your quoted language and thinks it fits more in (a). I have probably said worse in response to tasting notes from friends about Burgundies in threads about Burgundy tastings I have been to.
I don’t even want to imagine a world where this would be possible.
I would agree with Chris that the quoted statement is more (b) than (a) in the absence of context that may justify the statement.
I did not reply to the point/question made by the original poster.
Howard seemed to be said that threads do not exist where Burgundy lovers come into a thread and announce that wines are junk or overpriced. I pointed out the Marcassin thread(s) as an example. In that specific thread someone says that a K-B sells for $89 and is not worth $8.90. Another person said that he didn’t think the wines were honest and commented on the integrity of a reviewer.
That they happen to believe it or that it isn’t just their preference was not my point. Whether it is their “right”, or whether non-burg lovers do it more, or whether burg lovers praise other wines, or whether burg-lovers bash their own beloved burg was not my point. I was merely showing Howard an example. They are indeed not particularly rude, but Howard posited about the non-existence of exactly what they are. It’s really not a big deal, and indeed it cuts both ways. But please, it isn’t accurate to take one side and say that any one camp does not engage in trashing wines.
I read what John L. said in the thread and said he sounded like a burg-lover. He can tell me if I’m wrong, but I doubt it. I based it not simply on his dislike of Marcassin, but on his own explanations of what he looks for in wine and likes vs. dislikes. Not that differently, Howard above talks about not liking wines of high alcohol, overt oak, and I am sure all that love burg can expand further upon the traits they love. What is wrong with recognizing those preferences by a person and opining that the sound like a burg lover? There was no negative connotation attached to me saying he’s a burg lover and I’d go one step further and say that when I feel like that type of wine I’d be happy to find it in burgundy and often do.
What I said is that having that set of preferences, and even being a burg-lover in general, is likely to not find one fond of Marcassin. Sure there are people that like both, myself included to some extent, but they are very different wines so the common love is somewhat unlikely.
So let me see if I understand. Someone with a grand total of 14 posts says he is a Marcassin customer, but when he drinks the wines he finds he doesn’t like them (never mentioning Burgundy). So someone else says, well you must be a Burg lover to not like Marcassin. And someone else says, see here, a personal put-down from a Burg elitist. Did I get that right?
Because we’re better than everybody else, and so is our wine?? ![[cheers.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/0/0ff9bfcdb0964982cd3240b6159868fbdf215b1a.gif "cheers"){kind=small}
Just a thought. 
Seriously, I have no idea what you are talking about. Could you please elaborate.
This is a troll; why nourish it?
I think the burg folks spend more time in the burg threads, and the Cali folks spend more time in the Cali threads, so they notice more people bashing the wines they like.
Ditto. I mean if you ignore Nathan Smyth 90% of the Burgundy bashing disappears. Similarly I’d say that the adjective “most” is wildly inaccurate in the original post.
With all due respect, no you don’t understand and did not get it right. I tried to explain what I meant. I certainly DID NOT say that “you must be a burg lover to not like Marcassin”. Either you aren’t really trying to understand what I said, want to get into a feud by mis-stating what I said, or I am just a horrible communicator. Blame it on me.
Let’s keep it simple. In regard to the claim that burgundy drinkers do not jump into threads “and say wine is junk and overpriced” can you really look at someone in a thread saying “I wouldn’t pay $8.90, let alone $89” and maintain that position? My point is that the bashing is there, not whether it is the person’s right to do so or not, or whether they believe it or not. You tell me, is the “$8.90”
comment saying the wine is overpriced or not?
I still have not seen a link to the thread. I will say I have no idea who John L might be. Could be a burg lover, but don’t know him from Burg threads. If this is the best you can do, I don’t think there is a problem.
Criticism of Marcassin isn’t limited to burgundy lovers. They are polarizing wines. I recall a thread asking people which wines they were surprised were so hardly sought after. Marcassin showed up repeatedly, including among cali pinot/chard drinkers.
A