Haut-Médoc:Larose-Trintaudon. I’m pretty sure you’ll find this - it has been one of my Cru Bourgeois stalwarts for 30 years. Reliable and great value.
St.Julien: as a good value introduction to the taste of St.Julien, you could try Du Glana, which is two or three times cheaper than Clos du Marquis. Another one to try is Lagrange, one of the finest QPRs among the CCs.
Margaux: there are several different styles and this is one appellation where you really need to taste (although it is possible to like both BAMA and Lascombes, for example!).
As a MOR wine, not too expensive, you could try Du Tertre. It’s a little fruit-forward in style but not too much. Ferrière is good but I fear you’ll have trouble finding any.
Pauillac: Batailley, Haut Bages Libéral
Saint Estèphe: Lafon-Rochet
None of these are remotely spoofy, probably modern/traditional i suppose.
BTW you mention Belgrave - it’s not bad but I’ve rather lost patience. I used to love it in the 80s, but it has changed style so often since, not for the better, that I’ve given up. I still have a few. Anyway, for me no longer the best QPR in its category.
If I am looking for information on the styles of Bordeaux châteaux, I’d like to know whether they are leaning towards more modern or traditional style. As an oxymoron, modern/traditional isn’t particularly helpful.
Ha! Describing any Bordeaux style is a minefield these days. What some people describe as “modern” is to me actually old-fashioned, if it means high oak and high alcohol. But if a Fombrauge is therefore old-fashioned, where would that leave BAMA - somewhere in the Jurassic period?!
Well, to be clearer, then, I would say that they are traditional-style wines made with modern methods. So MOR, not Lascombes, but not BAMA either.
Well, that’s precisely why it’s a minefield. 20 years ago, it was easy - “traditional” meant 12.5° etc as you say, “modern” was super-ripe and “luxury oak”, etc. For me, a Monbousquet or a Fombrauge is now like a mullet hairstyle! Something truly up to date would for me be a Clos du Jaugueyron or a Closeries des Moussis, for example. Anyway, there was a thread about all this a few months back, I don’t remember the title.
I think it is easy. The same things still apply: old school has alcohol on the lower end of spectrum and less emphasis on the oak, the modern style is higher alcohol, more emphasis on the ripeness and lots of new oak. And it’s not just a question of one or the other, but there are so many shades of gray in-between. BAMA would be on the extreme old-school end of the spectrum and some “luxuriously oaked” 15,5% St. Émillions on the other end.
This does mean that a great majority of Bdx is more or less on the modern side of things, but that doesn’t change the way to classify. If a oak-driven, high-alcohol Bordeaux has been around for some 20 years, I really don’t think one can suddenly call it “traditionalist” now.
These will not be in your budget of $50, but you should look for the 1990 vintage of some of the wines that have been mentioned. While top 1990s (say Cheval Blanc, Latour or Margaux) might push $1k today, you can find 1990 Meyney for well under $100 (in the US) and it is a really fine wine. Sociando Mallet, La Louviere, and probably many others are as well. This is one of the great things about Bordeaux: Many of the modest wines age very well.
1990 is our anniversary year so I often look for interesting wines from that year. Generally when I‘ve taken a chance on a lower priced Bordeaux, I’ve been happy with it.
Yes I was looking at lower priced aged Bordeaux and it is indeed very affordable. No 1990 available here at the moment but a 1988 Sociando Mallet is floating at around A$45 and I suppose it might end around A$70 max. What else do you like to buy from 1990? I hear it’s a great vintage almost everyone and I will be spoiled for life, so I’d like to hear how you like to approach it.
Jan… Lots of tips in this thread. Some good and some are not so good. Of course that’s all in the eye of the taster.
My advice is to taste and keep notes on what you like, or not, and why. I’d do a lot of that before buying much of anything.
If there are tasting groups, socially distanced of course, join them.
Learn about vintages. They matter. For example, you’re looking at 88 Sociando Mallet. Sociando Mallet is not a generous wine to start with. And 88 is a less ripe, strict, austere vintage. The pairing of 88 and Sociando Mallet is quite lean and austere. You might like Sociando in riper vintages.
You should use my site for vintages, vineyards and tasting notes. You don’t need to agree with what I like or not. But you clearly get an idea of what a wine is and isn’t.
1988 Sociando is very good too and that price would be excellent. I have one bottle left that I bought on release.
There are lots of good 1990s at various price points. Some that aren’t too high are La Dominique, Leoville Barton and Pape Clement. If you can spend more, Lynch Bages and La Conseillante are great.
I haven’t had their 1990s anytime recently but some other lower priced wines that usually age well are Potensac, Chasse-Spleen and Cantemerle. I’ve recently had 1983 Chasse-Spleen and 1982 Potensac and both were in great shape.
Going outside of 1990, any of these would be excellent in 1989 as well, and of course most of the vintages mentioned by people above. There is a lot of good stuff from the 80’s in particular.
Excellent advice for you from Andy Sc above. Re the critics score at point 1, start with Bordoverview which is spreadsheet based and add in some more columns for the critics of your choice, that’s what I do every year.
This is an important point. Bordeaux isn’t generally difficult to get, and very few bottles get snapped up such that you have to act quickly or not miss out (though I’m speaking of the USA - not sure if it’s the same in Australia).
And there have been a lot of good vintages in the last 20 years, so you don’t have to feel pressured on getting in on the latest great vintage.
Time is on your side. Don’t feel like you need to load up on the first things you try and like. Keep your dollars and storage available for your continued exploration, which will yield more and more good results.
I think passion can be misguided and sometimes cover a variety of sins: 200% oak for Burgundy, Guy Accad, DeGrazia Barolo’s. The list seems endless, yet all these people had “passion”.
You can read critics and fill spreadsheets with scores, but nothing substitutes for your own experience. Critics and scores can give you some direction, but someone with knowledge who you taste with (not so easy now) can give you even more depth and context.
It takes time to learn what you like and understand your own palate. There are a lot of good specific recommendations from Chris Seiber and Julian Marshall in this thread. I’d try a few of them and read Jeff Leve’s notes on the wines after you’ve made your own impressions. Since tasting groups are not a thing right now, you might look for a knowledgeable retailer locally who can make suggestions and refine them after you give him feedback.
As others have pointed out, Chateau Meyney is often a good value at around $30-ish USD. Neal Martin at Vinous recently published notes on more than 15 different vintages of Chateau Meyney in a vertical tasting with the chateau and liked a good number of vintages, including (among others) 2009/2010/2017 as well as 2014/2015/2016, which came out slightly further ahead. He’s mentioned that 2015 also apparently did very well in a blind tasting amidst many more famous Bordeaux a while back. Finally, he mentioned the estate in a (freely available on YouTube) conversation with Antonio Galloni about the 2019 vintage. Some on this board have liked older vintages from the 80s, and clearly recent vintages are good, too. Something is going well at Chateau Meyney.
As Jeff Leve has noted, his site has a wealth of information on Bordeaux that I think you’ll find interesting and educational.