Interesting. Thank you.
I’m wirh Robert here, far too often a wine that doesn’t please immediately is got rid of, for instance in our monthly tasting group poured into the trash pot, instead of waiting until the end of the tasting for (maybe positive) change.
In my own tastings I always ask to put all rests back into the original bottles - all bottles go round after each flight with a fennel - ready for retasting at the end … or at least for me at home the next day.
Very educational …!
In thinking about this, think about reviewers who go through dozens of wines and make assessments based on ‘quick tastes’, or note on this board from large tastings where folks are in the same situation, and think how ‘valid’ these impressions may be instead of being able to sit with a wine longer. And remember that this not only applies to ‘bad’ wines but to ‘good’ ones as well - your initial reaction may change as that wine sits out longer, etc . . .
I’m 90 points on that.
To be fair, if you’ve been tasting widely for ten years you may have some clue that a wine isn’t quite ready. OTOH I have a friend who thinks that’s foolish because he thinks it’s weird to rate a wine based on potential, since you really have no way of predicting the future. He says a critic should just rate the wine on where it is when tasted, because that’s the only thing the critic really knows for sure.
In my case, if my wife doesn’t like a wine, I end up drinking it. Like that Grenache we had last night that she refused to drink.
If neither of us likes a wine but it isn’t flawed, we’ll cook with it. You can never have too much cooking wine IMO. And some dear friends of us gave us some wine for Christmas - that’s going to be cooking wine as well.
I’ve seen the sort of posts that prompted Robert’s OP. Hard to be sure how many were employing hyperbole or simply didn’t bother to post details of how much of a try they gave the wine. I doubt very many pour a displeasing wine down the drain after just a sip or two. Maybe a flawed poll is in order?
I’m happy to give a disappointing wine a chance. I’m drinking, not tasting, and there’s usually only 1, occasionally 2 bottles open at any given time. Going back to recheck hourly or even the next day is the routine here. If it’s really not worth drinking a day later we’ll cook with it or dump it. Unless it’s corked. TCA-afflicted wines go down the drain straight away. I don’t cook with them.
That’s exactly what I was going to write. (1) People use expressions like that to amplify their feelings about not liking the wine (e.g. former avatar photo of one poster pouring Harlan down the sink), and (2) posters don’t necessarily bother to always write out what steps occurred in between them first being disappointed by the wine and the eventual discarding of it.
But then again, I’d guess many of us (myself included) aren’t that diligent about checking and rechecking a wine we didn’t like over hours and days, either. I will usually set a disappointing bottle aside to see if air and time improve it, but then I often don’t end up being diligent about trying it hours and days later either. It depends a lot on the wine and what it was I didn’t like about it, whether those things suggest to me the likelihood of something better happening later on with the wine.
We drink a fair number of pretty old wine at some of our offlines, and I’m always surprised when I have to insist we don’t give up immediately on some wines that don’t impress upon opening.
It’s surprising how many of them do turn around and even impress after they’ve been given some time. Unless something is very clearly corked (often there is some debate if something is actually corked), there’s no harm in seeing what happens to it after an hour in the decanter.
Then again, I remember a wine that knocked my socks off for 30 seconds, and then it was gone, and I’m still not sure it was ever really there or if I only imagined it.
When I do not like a wine , I usually cook with it. f it is spoiled or really horrible I dump it.
I’ve had that happen too, Chris, where I’ve put a wine aside to try later and then forget about it for days, at which point it’s usually a goner. Those are “judgment reserved” in my book.
Me too. I’ve also seen people do that in person, including serious veteran winos. Some people are just very alpha like that. They confidently assign certain judgment and move on. “Nothing to learn here, folks!” But, another feature of alpha people is they project a disproportionate volume to their actions, so if you aren’t paying close attention, the actions or opinions of a few can seem mainstream.
One other thing I’d point out is that, increasingly in today’s world, when people don’t approve of or agree with something, they often feel the need to go all the way to the extreme of hating everything about that thing.
You don’t just disagree with a politician’s views and positions, he or she also has to be a terrible human being who has nefarious motives, cheated to win office, and is trying to do terrible things to our country. The fans of your football team’s rivals aren’t just people who root for a different team than you, they have to be bunch of bad, stupid people with embarrassing personal habits and so forth. You don’t like Wine Spectator, so they must be a corrupt business which sells high scores to wineries in exchange for advertising dollars.
And I’m not just pointing fingers, I realize I sometimes do the same thing (don’t ask my opinion about Texas A&M Aggies). It’s something we all have to catch ourselves about at times.
This is a very small example, but I think for similar reasons, “I didn’t care for this wine” or “this isn’t a style/type/producer that I like” ends up becoming “I took one sip and poured it down the drain” and “totally undrinkable” (see other thread about that on the board right now) and “DNPIM.” I recall a thread about Kosta Browne where one poster said he’d like to punch the winemakers in the face because of what he thought of their wines.
I also realize that some people are just being glib and lighthearted using those types of hyperbolic expressions (the Kosta Browne poster was not, though), and that even if they’re not, this is a very small deal in the scheme of things. I also think that WB has far less of that kind of tribalism and extremeness than most places on the web. But it did nonetheless strike me as being part of the larger trend.
I’m either a yak or an alcoholic because I don’t know the last time I poured a wine out unless it had been open for 3+ days.
That or I only drink great wines. ![[berserker.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/8/8600bbd4810d342b8fbd4ffb62b4f0026275fd37.gif "berserker"){kind=small}
I understand what the OP is saying. Seiber also sums up a lot of the points I would make. And I think the more than a few defensive responses here would indicate Robert touched on something.
Sure if a wine is completely cooked or TCA ridden it will go down the drain. But we know that’s not what he’s referring to. It’s more about the notes where people are pronouncing their tastes to the world and how important their disapproval of something can be.
The surprising thing to me is that people who use resources like this forum and CellarTracker would still end up purchasing wines that they prefer to boast about pouring down a drain than chilling out and relaxing with for a while.
Agree with the posts above … I´ve experiences similar habits quite often.
An extreme example (which I think I´ve told here already before):
After a quite comprehensive tasting of Northern Rhone whites I put some bottles with remains into a cardboard case in standing position … and forgot about it in my cellar for at least 8 months.
When I found it eventually a bottle of 1981 Hermitage blanc, which was quite disapointing in the tasting … and therefore refilled to app. to 1/3, proved to be not only sound and drinkable, but was really outstanding and a very impressive wine … performing in the 92-93 point-range.
“Down the drain” is entering the lexicon like “Back the truck up” did.
Us oenophiles are prone to prosaic pronouncements like that.
Valley kids had “gag me with a spoon,” we have “down the drain.”
Why do we drink wine? The taste and experience. If the taste and experience is displeasing, why keep drinking it? If you believe there is no hope of resuscitation, pour it down the drain. Corked 2008 Dom on new years eve was going right down the drain immediately. There is no curing the flaw. Stewed wine, down the drain.
I get that there is another issue…just a wine that’s not ideal, not to your preferences, etc. and whether that should go down the drain. That, to me, is an issue of degree. If it’s not my favorite, but still enjoyable for one reason or another, I’ll drink it. There are some Napa cabs above 15% that are a bit overboard but still have their own charm, to me. If I affirmatively do not like it, I won’t. I’ve had Napa cabs over 16 and dry grenache over 17.5 that I did not find enjoyable at all. If I can’t or don’t want to finish even one glass, I see no reason to force the issue. I do not need the alcohol. What is the difference between pouring it down the drain, or having 2/3 of a bottle spoil on my counter because I don’t want to drink it?
I don’t need the wine, and I have many surefire bets for enjoyment in my liquor cabinet and in other bottles of wine. Why force a masochistic slog through a displeasing bottle at all? Who cares what label is on it. Isn’t that the worst sin a self-proclaimed wine aficionado can commit? Taking some certain self-dishonest action because of a label or price paid?
As for things magically changing, I have had very, very few instances in which something went from being so bad and displeasing that I wanted to pour it down the drain to something enjoyable and worth appreciating. And in each of those instances, there was a reason. Like opening a 20 year old Aussie shiraz with an ultra-tight cork and suffering through massive reduction for a bit before the O2 finally helped it show its real colors. That’s about it, though. If we’re talking about the development of a Barolo or Rioja over a day or two, you should see that coming and getting caught with a day-later surprise on a wine like that is a matter of inexperience, not taste.
Drink what you want, pour out what you want.
Wut. It magically turn into this when you weren’t looking or what?
Alpha? Or more money than brains?
Down the drain = might as well burn my money. If the wine isn’t good, it absolutely gets dumped at the sink. Usually these are cheap bottles I grab at Costco or at a wine shop but there are very few bottles I have this issue with. If I’m drinking with family I will give them larger pours of wines I don’t care for and switch to another bottle.
I don´t know what this is supposed to be …?
You don´t have to believe anything I´ve written … I really don´t care …
but the wine (an Hermitage blanc 1981) - which was not very good initially in a comprehensive tasting - turned out to be oustanding after 8 months in a bottle, 2/3 empty and sitting in a cardboard box in my (I admit VERY cool) cellar.
That´s fact.
Nothing close to an oxidized Sherry, a perfectly mature white Hermitage!
But white Rhone can do that! Whether you look or not, they can transform. Ones that I had written off sometimes will come back to a life you wouldn’t have envisioned earlier.