Recent vintages have been clean for me too. Does anyone have a sense of when the style changed in this way, if it did?
Also, any thoughts on how 2005 Chavaroche is doing?
2016 Maestria was pretty funky early on.
âPolishedâ? âNoticeable new oak influenceâ? Those are fighting words for R. Alfert!
FYI, hereâs what the current US importer (now Skurnick) says about the winemaking:
The grapes are generally not destemmed before passing through a pneumatic press. The primary fermentation takes place in epoxy lined cuves. There is a long maceration and the cuvaison lasts three weeks. The fermentation temperatures reach 30 degrees centigrade. The malolactic fermentation normally finishes by the end of the year. The wine is then racked into large oak barrels where it spends the remainder of its first year. At the beginning of the second year, the wines are racked into medium-sized barrels (âdemi-muidâ) 10 â 15% of which are new. In the third year, the wines are racked again and left to complete the barrel aging in a mixture of âdemi-muidâ and small barrels. The wines are bottled after three years of barrel aging with a light fining and no filtration.
A year in 10-15% new demi-muids (600 liters) isnât a lot of new oak. Thatâs basically the necessary replacement rate. And a three-week cuvaison with stems isnât very modern.
Ha!
I have to admit, I donât think Iâve had any recent Levet since 2016. I have bought some recent vintages, but have not tried them. Frankly, I have been trying to slow down purchases of some estates that are already highly represented in my âcellarâ. I have a lot of the stuff, and to be completely candid, many of my friends and family members are not huge fans of it, so I end up drinking by myself.
Thanks for the input everyone!
My own notes for 2017 Chavaroche / PĂŠroline say 1/3 new oak for two years. Havenât recorded which size.
We also had 2015 Amethyste a little while ago, and it had a rather noticeable streak of toasty mocha oak character as well. Donât know about the amount of new oak for that vintage, but it must be a non-insignificant number.
Furthermore, I can come up with quite many wineries that might argue against the annual barrel replacement rate of 10-15%! 
I donât know how much modern producers use stems today (I guess it really depends on the producer and vintage), but to my understanding most modernist producers macerate the grapes for three to five weeks. I havenât noticed maceration times had much to do with the modernist / traditionalist divide.
JLL says re: PĂŠroline/Chavaroche:
100% Syrah from schist soils on Chavaroche (1 ha 1947, 0.5 ha 2004-10), until early 2020s 60% from schist soils on Chavaroche (1947), 40% from Mollard, Côte Brune, Côte Blonde (1978-80), whole bunch fermentation, 3 week vinification in 50 hl concrete vats, cap is immersed, twice daily pumping overs, held at 29°C aged 30% new, 70% used oak casks, barrels 24 months, egg white fined, unfiltered, called La Chavaroche in USA, 6,000 b**
Maestria/Journaries, on the other hand:
100% Syrah, 60% from west part of La Landonne (1940s, before 1953, gets early sun), 40% Côte Brune (late 1980s, 1990), Côte Blonde (1978-80), Côte Rozier, 30-50% destemmed, 3 week vinification in 50 hl concrete vats, cap is immersed, twice daily pumping overs, held at 29°C, aged either used 600-litre oak casks or large 30 hl barrels 24-26 months, egg white fined, unfiltered, first wine 2004, called Les Journaries in USA after the old name for La Landonne, 4,000 b**
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What, if any, producers in Cote Rotie are proudly making feral wines?
Of course what is âferalâ? Are you advocating for brett?
I struggle with the idea that a producer having good hygiene in the cellar is somehow a negative.
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Barge. Gallet. Burgaud. But I have not tasted recent vintages of any of these; I cellar Barge and Gallet.
Iâd add Stephan as well.
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I had a 2019 Burgaud CR and found it very clean and fruity. A good wine, but not what Iâm looking for when Iâm opening a N. Rhone.
Could be the vintage showing over any terroir - 2019 is very ripe. Older Burgauds are often rugged and wild. Who knows though, maybe he has cleaned up his act! JLL says âThe definite trend is towards clearer fruit and earlier accessibilityâ.
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Iâve really not tried many Stephan wines, and basically none with any age. I bought some 2020 CĂ´te-RĂ´ties Les Binardes and found it effusively fruity, floral, and savory, but with a distracting carbonic natural-wineyness on the finish. Do you drink a lot of Stephanâs wines?
Where do you place Chambeyron?
Ah! Well, the 2017 is classic, old-school savory goodness. I suppose it is âwild,â too, certainly traditional and very deep. No makeup. I love it.
I should specify that I mean Chambeyron-Manin. There is another producer who is just Chambeyron.
No, but Iâve definitely had some wild ones, the Tupin in particular. I do not like carbonic maceration though. I have a funny story about Stephanâs wines Iâll tell you about in person next time we have dinner.
Iâve stocked up until '17. Hopefully they were feral at least until then!!
What?!?!? Itâs been Rosenthal for the 30 years Iâve been paying attention and is still listed on their website: Vignobles Levet | Rosenthal Wine Merchant
Depends on how you feel about brett. Since they cleaned up, Beaucastel has never been the same for me, by which, I mean not as good.
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