The most underrated village in Burgundy

WINE TALK
21

Hay…guys.

Pommard, Volnay and NSG…are nominated for underrated. In Quebec, Canada the average popular wines being sold are from CAD $12-15…Village wines from Pommard, volnay and NSG…are occasion ( = especial ) wines. [pillow-fight.gif]

22

It used to be St-Aubin, but it’s been at the top of the under-rated list by the Burgundy cognoscenti over the years for so long that it’s now over-rated.

23

Happily in my Burgundy experience he’s been completely and entirely wrong about this. Many of the very greatest bottles I’ve drunk have cost just a few pounds. The very nature of the most exciting Burgundy experience is serendipity. Any fool can throw money at it.

24



Tom…you disquoted me. [tease.gif] I did not said that : **when it comes to the finest burgundies, you may not always get what you paid for but you will never get what you don’t pay for. ****

Meadows said - it ( which I found it quite interesting !!!). I am trying to get everyones here to agree that P-Vergel. is the most overrated village. neener


(Quote]




Here is what I said :


This remind me of what Meadows said ( in his The Pearl ) about the finest burgundies ( = G-crus ) : when it comes to the finest burgundies, you may not always get what you paid for but you will never get what you don’t pay for.

It is alright …to be always on the look-out …for the holy grail in burgundy but beware. What it meant is if one wants to look for the highest… Height For Enjoyment ( of Burgundy finest wines ) …one needs to pay for the price.

25

The sleeper vineyard in MSD for me is “Sorbe”. A fun blind tasting to do would include wines from the likes of Jouan, Fourrier, Magnien Truchout or Duband depending on the vintage plus Drouhin [sourced from Jouan] among others.

Happy Thanksgiving!

26

Random thoughts from a random poster:

There are NO values, much less bargains, from the Cote de Nuits except Fixin and Marsannay.

Saint Aubin has retired the trophy for best value whites. As Holmes said (I believe there’s a phrase, no sh*t Sherlock) “It used to be St-Aubin, but it’s been at the top of the under-rated list by the Burgundy cognoscenti over the years for so long that it’s now over-rated.” This would be true except the best are as good as almost all 1er Cru Chassagnes, Pulignys and Meursaults and still cost less than half as much. And from personal anecdotal evidence, seem less susceptible to Premox (plus they tend to be held less long), so I still buy them.

Savigny-les-Beaune has retired the trophy for best value reds, except for…

Pernand-Vergelesses. If board members wouldn’t buy wines they cannot spell or cannot pronounce, Burgundy prices would plummet, especially for Pernand, and I would be a happy man. Now I’m going to have to watch my spelling in this post, dammit.

Overall I think that Savigny remains the best value for reds, but I agree that Pernand Ile de Vergelesses should be a serious candidate for Grand Cru. Now please forget I wrote that and don’t think I’m going to tell you who my favorite producer is (Chandon de Briailles). And Beaune remains incredible value overall, just usually not quite worth the extra over Savigny.

Nuits-Saint-Georges is the most overrated and overpriced of the Cotes de Nuits villages. IMO it’s the only one where you never get great wine, just things with a little more weight and a little less finesse than Beaune (or Pommard or Volnay) for more money.

An old story (I think from Harry Waugh) about entering the British wine trade:
His boss said:
There are two kinds of wines, red and white. We sell red.
There are two kinds of red wines, Burgundy and other. We sell Burgundy.
There are two kinds of red Burgundy, Pommard and other. We sell Pommard.
Sell Pommard and you will have a stellar career.
That was when Pommard was cheap, Burgundy was cheap and wine in general was cheap.

IMO Pommard is the most overrated and overpriced village of the Cote de Beaune. This despite the fact that Epenots (no matter how you spell it) and Rugiens are arguably of Grand Cru quality (along with P Ile de V, Ursules and possibly Beaune Greves) and Courcel and Comte Armand are great producers. There is too much crap in Pommard at Pommard prices (see N St G for a parallel).

Dan Kravitz

27

Ok, if not Volnay, how about Maranges?

28

My first thought at seeing the thread title was MSD; since that’s taken, I propose… Corton reds as most underrated.

29

Definition of underrated depends upon how much emphasis an individual Burghead puts on quality vs $$.

Apart from comparing villages with each other, one can also compare within an appellation for specific 1er crus and GC that are underrated. eg Latricieres and Mazis are underrated compared with Clos de Beze and Chambertin.

I understand some villages are making inexpensive wines but they do not float my boat. I wouldn’t drink a Fixin -however underrated and cheap it is. Lamy is making good wine from St Aubin but the price has crept up too.

I would rather fork out more $$ to get a higher quality wine that is relatively underrated to its peers.

One can also compare within a particular producers wines to search for gems. Clos de la Roche from Rousseau is underrated cf Clos st Jacques, Clos de Beze and Chambertin. While the Clos de la Roche will never the lofty heights of Chambertin, I like its quality -price-ratio and in my books it falls in the “underrated” category from within the Rousseau portfolio.

30

Another vote for Fixin.

31

I was kidding. I’m pretty sure the only village name I pronounce correctly is Volnay.

I don’t know how many times someone has corrected my pronunciation of Musigny. I just can’t seem to master it. I’ll still drink it though.

32

Dujac is in Morey, right?
I seem to remember them on many “limit to 10 producers” lists
Tasted there last June–holy merde!

How about St Aubin? Not the top of my list but real deals abound.

33



How about St Aubin? Not the top of my list but real deals abound

Like Dan said - used to be but not anymore. As St. Audin - 1ieme cru from some of the prodcuers are quite pricey …NOW.
One of the reasons…that I shop around P-Verg for white as their 1ieme crus are bet CAD $30-35.

Dan… [welldone.gif] in post No. 26… [worship.gif]

34

OK…Musigny should be pronunced as :… Mooooose. [whistle.gif]

Now - Berry : try it again. I am sure you will master it.

35

Savigny? [whistle.gif]

36

my go to
and +1 on Pernand

37

I guess the reasons I singled out Morey are as follows. First, I love the wines and there are a lot of really good producers making wines from Morey (and wines of the style I like).

Also, I think that in the mind of most Burgundy lovers, the big three villages are Gevrey, Vosne and Chambolle. I would put Morey up there as a big four. I don’t think there really is much of an argument that Nuits St. Georges is in the same class, at least not based on the wines I have had. I love a great Pommard, but ditto. I think the only other village that has an argument to be in the top class is Volnay, and I love the wines from there.

I love Chandon des Briailles and their Ile des Vergelesses. But name other great producers from that vineyard.

38

Rapet–different from CdB but still wonderful

39

Its the last part I guess I pronounce wrong. I say "moose-ig-knee " and I guess thats wrong but it seems impossible to reprogram my brain to say it right. I guess it is supposed to be “moose-ee-knee”

When you write stuff like that do you mean to sound condescending and smart-ass teasing in tone? I have to admit I often am not sure how to read the tone of your writing.

40

"Any Rugiens/Epenots " I guess that is why they are applying for Grand Cru status

I’m pretty inexperienced at burgundy, so I’m going out on a limb here to list givry. Reason is I tasted the Michel Sarrazin champs lalot givry at $17 and it’s better than most 1er’s I’ve tasted. Great stuff