This is why the critical model pisses me off

WINE TALK
1

I JUST got my 3 pack of the 2011 Estate not more than a week ago, I have not even tried one yet. Given the vintage, and knowing the touch of Jeff Pisoni, I figured the wine ought to be as good as the 2008, maybe better. I am eager to try a bottle and see what Jeff and Mark got from the vintage.

Yet, already the wine is after market on Wine Bid for $300 for a 3 pack. $100 a frigging bottle. Yet, when I did my order just a few months ago, I paid $210 for the same 3 pack.

What’s the point? My point is this:

The Wine Advocate 96
A ripe, voluptuous effort that dishes out thrilling levels of fruit… …possesses layers of kirsch, black currants, black raspberry, licorice, sweet spice and crushed flower-like aromas and flavors that flow seamlessly…”

Because a critic, one voice sounded off, the market now enjoys an inflated price. The same damn thing happened to the 2008 Estate, which is a fantastic bottle of CA pinot noir, now again after market well over $100 and has been for some time. On the 2008, it is this:

Robert M. Parker Jr. 98
An absolutely stunning fireworks display of aromatics emerges when the nose gets close to the glass… … Extremely layered, velvety-textured, and opulent, with a finish that goes on for 50 seconds…”

You know what? I detest the critical model. Look, I get it, it drives the industry and handful of guys who write about wine and attach a numeric value to the product end up driving the momentum for the entire business. I get it, I can’t stand it.

The 2011 above is the worst example of this stupid model and it simply pisses me off.

To Jeff, Mark and Gary, they have been making excellent CA pinot for over a decade and I have been with them every vintage along the way. This is not about them. This is about the critcial industry, that has convinced and so influenced a buying public that people cannot breathe or take a dump without knowing what the score on the wine is.

Enough already.

Eric Levine, god bless you for creating a database of the community’s view on wine. Bravo. [thankyou.gif]

2

Wow. And I thought this incredible wine was flying under the radar?

I don’t pay attention to the secondary market, but it may put upward pressure on direct prices.

3

My pleasure. Thanks for the thanks!

4

Frank, I’d say it’s not so much the “model” of wine critiquing that’s bad, it’s the narcissism of a very few critics (notably Parker) who love to puff themselves up by granting high scores to many, many wines. You and I disagree a bit on the whole notion of “scoring,” but if scores were more reasonable, they wouldn’t start stampedes for wines like this. I’d also be fine without scores entirely, though I contend they are just another way of saying “I think this wine has some qualities that make it more interesting, and somehow ‘better’ than another wine.”

5
  • A Gazillion…Go Get 'Em Frank!!!
6

You just need to switch to Italian wine now, where it seems critics these days have less of an impact!

You can still get Monprivato for less than $100 a bottle, but who knows how long that will last. Since this wine will most likely outlive me, my only strategy now is to start buying in VOLUME!

7

I’m not sure how great of an example Monprivato is. That wine has doubled in price in the last decade. It wasn’t because of high critical ratings as much (though it does get those in recent years), but it just goes to show that you that when demand goes up, for any reason, whether Parker/WS scores or because the wine gains popularity in elite wine circles, the price usually goes up as well.

Frank, what is it about the rising aftermarket price of this wine that upsets you? You already bought yours direct at the list price, and I know you don’t buy wines to resell, so how does it affect you that the aftermarket price ends up being higher or lower than what you paid? Would you care if you found out that the wine was reselling on winebid for $50 a bottle instead of $100?

Not a criticism in the least, just trying to understand why this news affects you the way it does. I’ve bought wine that turned out to be worth a lot more in resale, and (much more often) I’ve bought wine that turned out to be worth a lot less in resale, but if I bought it just to keep and to drink myself, I never figured it really made any difference other than just sort of academic curiosity.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

8

My three pack arrived and I stacked the wooden box up on top of the 2010, and 2009, and 2008 etc. I don’t need Bobby Parkerchuk or Antonio Laube to tell me what I like. I do hear you in your criticism that the praises of influential wine writers seem to raise a false demand (like the frenzy over the WOTY).

It is funny, that with pressure that is put on top California wines, as the prices rise, I seem to start exploring new areas for bargains.
My Sicilian wines look like they’re in the “daily drinker” category when compared to prices of some of the more “popular” Pinots from California and Oregon. I just wish that more of the good stuff was widely available, or, in some cases, even imported into the States.

9

Luckily, there continues to be great CA wines at more than fair prices from the likes of Carlisle, Bedrock, Jaffurs, and many many others…

10

Frank still gets to rant. It took us a long time to understand that the French government was hanging medals around Parker’s neck for moving French product, not for his contributions to consumerism (especially when French consumers were not reading Parker). It is at least clear now that Parker and the other reviewers are ultimately no better, and dramatically less articulate, than those legendary Brits pimping the wines and leaving their trunks open to receive the free cases of Bordeaux…

11

How true, Larry. And not just Calif. Just ordered the Ojai Calif Syrah '11 at < $24/btl. Stupid/silly price.
Tom

12

This reminds me of someone who finds a restaurant that they think is great, but doesn’t want to tell anyone for fear it might become more difficult to get a table. Obviously if everyone thought that way, the restaurant wouldn’t stay open for very long, regardless of how good it is. As far as a database of the community’s views on wines, I guess that translates to keeping the great finds secret, only known in large part to the geeks like us who spend so much time with this preoccupation. But there will always be those people who place greater importance on the advice of a trusted professional critic, who they feel has a palate aligned with their own, than advice based on consensus. If prices increase as a result of publicity, well that’s the marketplace, right?

13

What/who are you referring to here?

14

The pre-Parker British wine writers alleged to have taken wine, meals and other junket items in exchange for kind notices on crappy wines and/or vintages. (It was said that, at the time, a common practice was to discreetly leave one’s trunk open so that someone from the subject winery could drop a couple of cases in. Probably more urban myth than reality, but a great story anyway.) In other words, the Jamie Goodes of their day! :slight_smile: Well, in his case, I cannot actually verify the consistency of the kind notices part…only the junkets…

15

It is a double edged sword. It is always nice to get some exposure for a wine/producer/region. It really helps the business work. But not so much that it puts too much pressure on the price or changes it in a dramatic fashion. It’s not only in wine. Works for restaurants and many other things as well. I remember seeing REM when they couldn’t fill an 800 seat hall. Later on they couldn’t play anything less than 10,000 seats. And the price was triple. It sucks, but it is the way of the world.

16

Succinctly put, Gary. I suppose, ultimately, it is for wine sellers and retailers to decide whether the critical score triggers a price hike. And that is…well…business, I guess. Hard to fault 'em for needing to do it, if not perhaps wanting to do it. Perhaps the “trouble” is that critics are getting access to so many erstwhile “under-the-radar” wines now.

Hey, man, in the wilds of Ontario, I’m just happy that they’re bringing back some Luneau-Papin Muscadet after about a 3 or 4 year hiatus. I’ll be buying a half-case at least, if not more, this upcoming weekend.

Sante,

Mike

17

Hi Frank,

Is your issue with the surge in after market pricing due to reviews the idea that it puts pressure on the wineries to raise the original offer pricing thus making it difficult for their original supporters to remain on the list? I sympathize with that problem but I can’t object to wineries trying to make as much money as they can. Schrader partially handled that situation by holding back a fairly large amount of wine and selling it on the auction market themselves. Obviously that limits the amount available to their list but allows Schrader to take advantage of stratospheric rises in after market pricing. Unfortunately, CellarTracker reviews never seem to appear in enough time to acquire the wine at original market prices but at least do not seem to impact secondary market pricing much if at all. Thanks as well to Eric!

18

I’ve heard the same rumor about a particular English critic, and not ‘pre-Parker’ either, if Parker’s reign started in '83 or so. Almost all of them take ‘junkets.’

19

Me thinks there is a biz model here…

Whilst Parker’s tomes have been translated into French (and his book on Bordeaux and the Rhone is actually decent if you ignore the scoring), in Europe wine consumers either give much more credence to their own palates or they follow guides whose ratings are based on blind tastings performed by a group of peers which provides obvious advantages.

In France you have the Guide Hachette, which during the course of the many years that I lived in Europe became almost a bible for wine buyers. Or better again, in the Valais (CH) they have a spring and fall ritual of the “Sélection Vins du Valais” which is a 100% peer competition for which they award gold, silver and bronze medals. What a concept of the NVV and Sonoma people actually taking a bit into their own hands?? And the Gambero Rosso…

All of these share a common thread: blind tastings (love to see Parker try to do a blind), peer participation and the elimination of the stupid 100 point system.

20

Like most of you, as the years have gone on, the number of wineries I’ve visited, tastings I’ve attended, bottles I’ve opened, and things I’ve read (WB, blogs, CT, etc.) have made me less and less interested in critical scores and reviews. At this point, I mostly only even notice the scores from when I look on CT or if they come as advertising from wineries I buy from.

But, I realize that 99.9% of people who drink wine do not have the time, interest and money to have learned as much about wine as us WBers have. And it makes sense to me that if one of that 99.9% were walking into BevMo or Total Wine or Costco or wherever, wanting to spend $30 on a nice wine to bring to a dinner party or something, they might see a bottle that got 93 WS and 94 RP and think that’s got better odds than just picking based on what some guy from the office recommended once, or what the idiot sales clerk says, or anything else.

Plus, most people in that 99.9% are not going to find ripe, concentrated fruit to be a negative, nor are they really desirous of a wine that tastes like compost, tobacco, black olives and gravel. So those recommendations might work just fine for them a lot of the time, or at least better than the alternatives known and available to them. And as this person buys and enjoys some more bottles of good quality wine, he might get the bug, start trying more things and developing his palate, and maybe end up the next Keith Levenberg a decade from now railing against Parker and modernism in wine.

This isn’t a response to Frank’s example regarding $70/bottle Pisoni Estate off the mailing list, but just as to the role of critics generally. I think they can serve a useful purpose to many people in many situations, in a similar way to movie critics, automotive critics and restaurant critics, even if they do not very much purpose to those of us WBers at this point in our journeys.