Same experience here. Some big surprises with some 2011 recently. They were drinking well, to my surprise. I even expected green notes but instead got fine, enjoyable, light Cali Cabs. But I still wouldn’t buy them. While they are not green in anyway, the lack of depth is obvious and when analyzing the wines properly, that becomes instantly visible.
“Cult wines” are defined by the by the decade in which they emanated from, and folks there is only one, The Nineties! Prized heavyweights grew up that decade. The other criteria of course being a lengthy waiting list. The latter of which have all evaporated save for Screaming Eagle 
Most of the cults mailing lists have endured 90%+ turnover.
Gee I wonder why?
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I had my first cult cabernet in March this year, it was Bryant 2002, it it was the best wine I have ever had ( 98/100), so fully met my expectations.
Obviously in perfect balance, out of this world texture, without heaviness nor overoaked.
By the way, if someone is disturbed by richness in wine, should switch to another drink than wine…
The mailing listers feasted by selling 1/2 their allocations on the secondary market to pay for the 1/2 they kept and drank. It’s only so long before a producer is going to realize that’s happening and start selling their wines for “market” prices. Anything you can still buy for 1/2 the secondary market going rate still has a long, slow waiting list — it’s just the number of producers still willing to do that has evaporated.
I think the conclusion is to stay with my Mondavi Reserves rather than splashing on these high end bottles. Thanks all!
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The lists evaporated because prices skyrocketed and demand plummeted. Consumers got smart and the Cults were blindsided!
At least with Harlan and Bryant, for a 4 year run some folks cashed in and got to drink half their allocation for free.
I have a very similar take on Dan’s, with probably even less levels of experience (i.e. just a handful of these wines).
That said, I’d be very curious to hear from any of our higher rollers who have had many Harlans through the years, particularly with 12+ years maturation. I’ve only had two, it’s been nearly 10 years since the last I tried one, and I remember being very, very impressed with the texture. Yes, they didn’t have European nuance or ‘terroir’ (whatever you define that as), but they struck me as exceptionally well made.
Also, my assumption is that newer Harlans are bigger than older Harlans, right? Particularly those from the 90s that got the 100* label?
I doubt the newer Harlan’s are bigger than the older ones. Certainly the 90’s Harlan’s were extravagant wines, and pleasing to me.
Bryant however made perhaps the finest Cult wine for with their 1994 and 1995. Helen Turley!
This!!
I think it’s fair to say from this thread that one man’s cult is another man’s religion.
They aren’t Araujo, since that family kept their name. Chateau Latour took it over and it’s very much their style. They sell more of it in France than the U.S. Very classic, structured, age-worthy. They looked at the pre-Araujo Eiseles to see the potential of the site, which is truly great. I think they’re worth the price for someone willing to cellar them for at least 25 years. But, probably not is consumed too young. Easily the best vineyard and winemaking in Napa to my perspective. I’m too old and cheap to back that up with my wallet though.
I think it’s more that, gradually over time, the wineries raised prices so that they were realizing closer to the market value of the wines.
If you look at retail and auction prices for Harlan, they’re generally still a hundred or a couple of hundred higher than the release price to list members, but it’s no longer like Harlan is releasing them for half the market value such that there is big flipping potential and the customer is realizing a big chunk of the value rather than the winery. And the winery is probably still doing very well.
Of course, every winery is its own story, but I think “prices migrated up closer to market value” is more the story in general than demand plummeting and the wineries being left holding the bag.
Newer Harlans since at least 2006 are more elegant and structured, with less overt ripeness. Peak ripeness for Harlan was 1997, in my view. Honestly, I adore the 1993-1996 Harlans that still had a nice chunk of Merlot in them. Same with the Lail until 2002. I little Merlot goes a lonnnnnng way to mellowing out potential excesses in our neck of the woods. Would kill to have 5-10% Merlot in my own Cab, except no one is gonna sell me 1/4 ton of top Merlot fruit and even if they did it would be hard to ferment it.
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Thanks so much for your thoughts, Roy. Very interesting sentiments. Particularly that last point. Very, very interesting stuff.
Roy, is there no Merlot in any of the great vineyards you take Cab from? Could you do a little sneaky field blend if there was?
And again, thank you for your informative and transparent videos.
Mike,
I don’t swim in those waters any more. My general experience with Eisele is the older the better, love the old Phelps bottlings. I drank my stash way too soon.
Wes,
Thanks for the info, sounds like I would enjoy them. Unfortunately I’m not equipped to buy at the current price point.
Another option would be a swap. Someone with nice Merlot might be happy to trade a little for some of your Cab. Trading juice would solve the fermentation issue and allow you to assess the vintage beforehand.
Sorry if someone has already mentioned this but if you like these wines or any other expensive wines there is great benefit to joining a tasting group so you can pool your expensive stuff and get a chance to taste a nice cross section of wines a few times a year. That is, assuming we eventually get back to normal.
Brent,
I’m with you on Eisele and Phelps.
I have had a strange trifecta. In three cases I opened a legend, 1984 Ridge Monte Bello Cabernet side-by-side with three other equally worthy California Cabs.
One comparison was '84 Monte Bello with '84 Heitz Martha’s. Heitz was preferred.
One was '84 Monte Bello with '84 Mount Eden. Mount Eden was preferred.
One was ''84 Monte Bello with '78 Phelps Eisele. Phelps Eisele was preferred.
That is saying a lot.
Even if I stretched the budget to include current releases, at 73 years of age I am dubious about being able to enjoy them at maturity.
Dan Kravitz
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